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Lincoln 10 mei 2004 11:32
NEW PoW TORTURE CLAIMS ROCK COALITION May 10 2004

By Paul Gilfeather, Whitehall Editor, Anthony Harwood, Us Editor, And Rod Chaytor

COALITION forces were yesterday accused of a catalogue of sex crimes against Iraqi prisoners.

US forces were alleged to have committed wide ranging sex attacks on prisoners. And three British soldiers were said to be facing sex assault charges.

London and Washington were braced for a fierce backlash from the new revelations.

New Yorker magazine published a photo of dogs threatening a naked inmate at Abu Ghraib prison and of the same man with blood streaming from his leg after he was apparently bitten.

The US was expecting the publication of more photos and a video from the notorious jail in Baghdad.

They are thought to show US soldiers raping a woman prisoner.

Troops are also seen beating a detainee to within an inch of his life.

A video is expected to emerge - taken by US soldiers - showing young boys being raped by Iraqi guards.

Photos of soldiers "acting inappropriately with a dead body" also exist. One accused, Sabrina Harman, is said to be posing with a decomposing corpse with her thumbs up. Pentagon sources warned that the abuse of dead bodies - possibly murder victims - is a recurring feature in the sickening material.

It was announced that the unreleased pictures will be handed over to Congress by the Pentagon.

Senator John Warner said lawmakers would be allowed to view them in private.

But Senator Lindsey Graham said the Bush administration needed to make the photos public as soon as possible.

He said: "If there's more to come, let's get it out. For God's sake let's talk about it because men and women's lives are at stake."

Last week Mr Graham warned: "The public need to understand we're talking about rape and murder here."

The administration is prepared for damaging fallout. A worried defence official said: "It is a time bomb."

The expected stream of filth loomed as British troops were also accused of sexually abusing prisoners. Three soldiers of the Royal Regiment of Fusiliers are said to face charges of sexual assault, inciting rape and breach of the Geneva Convention after photos showed prisoners being forced to take part in homosexual acts.

The abuses came to light when staff at a photo lab alerted police.

Kelly Tilford, who worked at the Max Spielman photographic shop in Tamworth, Staffs, yesterday described in graphic detail the pictures she saw of Iraqis being sexually abused.

Kelly, 23, was processing a film taken by soldier Gary Bartlam a year ago.

She handed the pictures to police. They passed them to military authorities who launched a probe.

Kelly told the Mirror: "It was a film of about 24 pictures, all taken in Iraq. Most showed general scenes of soldiers holding weapons, posing for the camera. But there were four that really shocked and disgusted me - they were horrible.

"The first showed a prisoner being forced to perform oral sex on a soldier. The prisoner was screwing up his face in disgust. He looked deeply ashamed.

"The second showed two naked Iraqi men with one apparently being forced to rape another.

"The third appears to be taken in some kind of warehouse and showed a naked Iraqi, looking terrified, being dangled in a net from the lifting gear of a forklift truck.

"He was being held about 15ft off the ground and looked absolutely petrified. At the wheel of the forklift was a soldier in uniform and you could clearly see his face. Two British soldiers were watching what was going on and smirking.

"The fourth showed a group of Iraqi men, all naked, sitting on the ground. There were about 10 of them sitting or squashed up together but none of them was on top of another.

"Some of them looked scared, some of them looked ashamed."

Labour MP Alice Mahon said: "This sickening twist to this already horrific tale diminishes us all. The news that Iraqi women and children were raped is a truly horrifying turn for the worse.

"Are we really to believe that these soldiers are the only ones responsible? Was there not a chain of command?

"We need answers from Washington and London about what orders those involved were given."

Confirmation of the new batch of images came from US Defence Secretary Donald Rumsfeld last week. During evidence to the Senate he revealed that video and "sadistic, cruel and inhuman" photos were just around the corner.

New Yorker investigative journalist Seymour Hersh claimed yesterday that cameras were part of the interrogation process, with threats made to detainees that pictures of them naked would be shown to friends and neighbours.

Mitgard 10 mei 2004 11:49
misschien is het deze keer wel echt folteren i.p.v. beetje spelen.

Lincoln 10 mei 2004 12:01
Citaat:
Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Mitgard
misschien is het deze keer wel echt folteren i.p.v. beetje spelen.
Mischien , we zullen nog zien wat er van komt met buchke een z'n poep hondje "rumsfield"!

dagallemaal 11 mei 2004 07:43
Wat er in Irak gebeurd is kan natuurlijk niet goedgekeurd worden, maar men mag niet vergeten dat de Irakezen wel wat meer gewoon zijn dan een paar fotos. Maar ja er zijn zaken waar ze over feesten en andere die ze niet apprecieren....

Citaat:
Persecution was at its worst at the end of 1968. Scores were jailed upon the discovery of a local "spy ring" composed of Jewish businessmen. Fourteen men-eleven of them Jews-were sentenced to death in staged trials and hanged in the public squares of Baghdad; others died of torture. On January 27, 1969, Baghdad Radio called upon Iraqis to "come and enjoy the feast."

Some 500,000 men, women and children paraded and danced past the scaffolds where the bodies of the hanged Jews swung; the mob rhythmically chanted "Death to Israel" and "Death to all traitors." This display brought a world-wide public outcry that Radio Baghdad dismissed by declaring: "We hanged spies, but the Jews crucified Christ." (Judith Miller and Laurie Mylroie, Saddam Hussein and the Crisis in the Gulf, p. 34).

straddle 11 mei 2004 08:43
Ik heb het al gezegd hé, het is degoutant die foto's, en zeer moeilijk goed te praten. De schuldigen zullen gestraft worden. Koppen zullen rollen. En onze "eigen" westerse pers en publieke opinie nemen dit niet van de daders. Het wordt van binnenuit onze samenleving aangeklaagd. Gelukkig maar dat er waardenbesef is vanwege een overgrote meerderheid in onze samenleving om die dingen bloot te leggen. De VS zal dit "probleem" moeten meeslepen voor de komende 10-20 jaar.

Anderzijds, waarom staan er hier een paar te springen om constant nieuwe threads te openen over die foto's, met zo'n ijver. Waar bleven hun postings en ijver om de wandaden van Sadam te veroordelen? Waar bleven hun commentaren en postings, hun ijver om de niet aflantende moslimterreur te veroordelen?? Merkten we bij hen dan niet een zeker begrip en een zekere sympathie voor de terroristen? Waar blijft hun waardenbesef dan? Er wordt nog te veel met twee maten en gewichten gewogen door sommigen.

dagallemaal 11 mei 2004 09:06
Hier wat meer details over wat de Irakezen gewoon zijn buiten foto's.
Het is ook niet nodig te vertellen dat deze misdaden tegen de menselijkheid niet het minste protest gekregen hebben vanwege de toenmalige linkies noch de islamitische landen.
http://www.dangoor.com/71page29.html
en er zijn zo honderden pagina's. Zoek gewoon naar "Baghdad january 1969 jews".

Citaat:
Thirty years ago today 9 innocent Jews were publicly hanged in Baghdad's so-called 'Liberation Square,' falsely accused of spying for Israel. This atrocity shocked the civilised world and focused world attention on the cause of Jews of Arab Lands with all that implies especially in terms of human rights.

In London the day after the hangings with lurid photographs in the press, there was a mass protest demonstration outside the Iraqi Embassy in Kensington, London of over 5,000 people, organised by the Board of Deputies, the Spanish & Portuguese Synagogue and other communal bodies. So effective was it that the Iraqi authorities summoned the British ambassador in Baghdad to complain about it and he replied that Britain was a free, democratic country and people were free to express their sense of outrage at such incidents.

At the time, Hassan al-Bakr was President of Iraq and Saddam Hussein was his right-hand man, whose Ba'ath Party had seized power in a military coup six months before. The Jewish community in Baghdad traced its origins to Babylonian times, 2,500 years ago making immense contributions to the development of Judaism through the Babylonian Talmud, the Religious academies, fruitful exchange of rabbis and scholars with Spain, and subsequently. In fact, the modern Baghdad is about 190 miles from the ancient Babylon and Iraq's President Saddam Hussein had plans to develop it as a major tourist attraction, which was nullified by his invasion of Kuwait in August 1990, and the ongoing crisis caused by Iraq's weapons of mass destruction.

This service is a Kiddush Hashem and reflects great honour on the martyrs and all present here this evening. The Psalm 137 read earlier refers specifically to the Babylonian community, beginning: 'there by the waters of Babylon, we hanged our harps on the willows and wept at the remembrance of Zion.' Later in the Psalm are the words, 'If I forget thee, O Jerusalem, let my right hand forget her skill' which Dr. Theodor Herzl used as the rallying cry for the establishment in 1948. Two months before the 1969 hangings, the World Jewish Congress was warning of the impending tragedy.

Following are extracts of a statement to the Maariv newspaper in Tel-Aviv in March 1991 made by Mrs Selima Gubbay, widow of Fuad Gubbay one of the martyrs, after Iraqi Scud missiles attacked Israel. Israel which had not joined the coalition to drive Iraq out of Kuwait, in accordance with UN resolutions.

'Fuad and I were so happy when suddenly our lives were torn apart. One day four Iraqi officers in a blue Volkswagen drove into our home in Basra. They went straight to the air conditioners and pulled out the transformers. 'These are transmitters,' they shouted, 'you are spying for Israel.' Fuad was roughed up when he protested. Our younger son, David, was picked up and thrown against the railings when he tried to kiss his father. He cut himself, and his face was full of blood. The blood was an evil omen of the future. It was 1968 and I was four months pregnant. Fuad was taken away to a jail in Baghdad. Eventually, he was put on trial with other Jews, all accused of spying for Israel. The trial was broadcasted live on radio and television. Fuad pleaded not guilty. I travelled from Basra to Baghdad to see him in prison. When I got there they pushed me into a room beat me up and kicked me out. In the next room, separated only by a thin wall, the warders were telling Fuad, 'your wife is on the other side of the wall. She's pregnant. If you don't admit your guilt, we're going to rape her, and afterwards open her stomach and cut up the child.'

'The next day during the broadcast of the trial, I heard Fuad pleading guilty, admitting that on such and such days, he was here and there, sending secrets to Israel. When I checked the dates, I realised that Fuad had been with me and the children all of those times. He had made up the story in order to save us. On the morning of January 27, 1969, the streets of Baghdad were even more noisy and crowded than usual. It was the day of the hangings. A day of national celebration. I could hear the neighbours shouting enthusiastically, 'Hang the Israeli spies.' Dancers were brought from far and wide to dance under the gallows. There were free rides on the buses and trams so that people could come and celebrate under the corpses. And what was all the celebration about? The Iraqi nation was taking its collective revenge for defeat of a division on the Jordan front in the Six Day War, and that is how Iraqi television was broadcasting pictures of 9 hanging Jewish corpses, among them my husband Fuad, all innocent people. The loudspeakers announced that from 4 o'clock that afternoon, the bodies would be brought down so that the mob could deal with them in the streets (ooit iets meer barbaars gehoord of gezien sinds de Nazi's). I returned to Basra and people, including Jews, avoided me for fear of being linked with my husband's so-called activities.'

Mrs Gubbay then described how she fled to Israel with her children in July 1971.

Over 50 more Jews were, after 1969, executed or died through torture in jail. Martyrdom is, unfortunately, not a new phenomenon in Jewish history. But the Jewish People, because of its adherence to the eternal Torah, has acquired the characteristic of eternity. This is exemplified now by our beloved State of Israel and the survival of the Jewish People in all lands of freedom and democracy. May we go from strength to strength, mechayil lechayil.

dejohan 11 mei 2004 12:34
Citaat:
Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Mitgard
misschien is het deze keer wel echt folteren i.p.v. beetje spelen.

Beetje spelen? Maak het zelf maar eens mee, ge zult heel uw leven slecht slapen.

dejohan 11 mei 2004 12:36
Citaat:
Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door dagallemaal
Hier wat meer details over wat de Irakezen gewoon zijn buiten foto's.
Het is ook niet nodig te vertellen dat deze misdaden tegen de menselijkheid niet het minste protest gekregen hebben vanwege de toenmalige linkies noch de islamitische landen.
http://www.dangoor.com/71page29.html
en er zijn zo honderden pagina's. Zoek gewoon naar "Baghdad january 1969 jews".

Citaat:
Thirty years ago today 9 innocent Jews were publicly hanged in Baghdad's so-called 'Liberation Square,' falsely accused of spying for Israel. This atrocity shocked the civilised world and focused world attention on the cause of Jews of Arab Lands with all that implies especially in terms of human rights.

In London the day after the hangings with lurid photographs in the press, there was a mass protest demonstration outside the Iraqi Embassy in Kensington, London of over 5,000 people, organised by the Board of Deputies, the Spanish & Portuguese Synagogue and other communal bodies. So effective was it that the Iraqi authorities summoned the British ambassador in Baghdad to complain about it and he replied that Britain was a free, democratic country and people were free to express their sense of outrage at such incidents.

At the time, Hassan al-Bakr was President of Iraq and Saddam Hussein was his right-hand man, whose Ba'ath Party had seized power in a military coup six months before. The Jewish community in Baghdad traced its origins to Babylonian times, 2,500 years ago making immense contributions to the development of Judaism through the Babylonian Talmud, the Religious academies, fruitful exchange of rabbis and scholars with Spain, and subsequently. In fact, the modern Baghdad is about 190 miles from the ancient Babylon and Iraq's President Saddam Hussein had plans to develop it as a major tourist attraction, which was nullified by his invasion of Kuwait in August 1990, and the ongoing crisis caused by Iraq's weapons of mass destruction.

This service is a Kiddush Hashem and reflects great honour on the martyrs and all present here this evening. The Psalm 137 read earlier refers specifically to the Babylonian community, beginning: 'there by the waters of Babylon, we hanged our harps on the willows and wept at the remembrance of Zion.' Later in the Psalm are the words, 'If I forget thee, O Jerusalem, let my right hand forget her skill' which Dr. Theodor Herzl used as the rallying cry for the establishment in 1948. Two months before the 1969 hangings, the World Jewish Congress was warning of the impending tragedy.

Following are extracts of a statement to the Maariv newspaper in Tel-Aviv in March 1991 made by Mrs Selima Gubbay, widow of Fuad Gubbay one of the martyrs, after Iraqi Scud missiles attacked Israel. Israel which had not joined the coalition to drive Iraq out of Kuwait, in accordance with UN resolutions.

'Fuad and I were so happy when suddenly our lives were torn apart. One day four Iraqi officers in a blue Volkswagen drove into our home in Basra. They went straight to the air conditioners and pulled out the transformers. 'These are transmitters,' they shouted, 'you are spying for Israel.' Fuad was roughed up when he protested. Our younger son, David, was picked up and thrown against the railings when he tried to kiss his father. He cut himself, and his face was full of blood. The blood was an evil omen of the future. It was 1968 and I was four months pregnant. Fuad was taken away to a jail in Baghdad. Eventually, he was put on trial with other Jews, all accused of spying for Israel. The trial was broadcasted live on radio and television. Fuad pleaded not guilty. I travelled from Basra to Baghdad to see him in prison. When I got there they pushed me into a room beat me up and kicked me out. In the next room, separated only by a thin wall, the warders were telling Fuad, 'your wife is on the other side of the wall. She's pregnant. If you don't admit your guilt, we're going to rape her, and afterwards open her stomach and cut up the child.'

'The next day during the broadcast of the trial, I heard Fuad pleading guilty, admitting that on such and such days, he was here and there, sending secrets to Israel. When I checked the dates, I realised that Fuad had been with me and the children all of those times. He had made up the story in order to save us. On the morning of January 27, 1969, the streets of Baghdad were even more noisy and crowded than usual. It was the day of the hangings. A day of national celebration. I could hear the neighbours shouting enthusiastically, 'Hang the Israeli spies.' Dancers were brought from far and wide to dance under the gallows. There were free rides on the buses and trams so that people could come and celebrate under the corpses. And what was all the celebration about? The Iraqi nation was taking its collective revenge for defeat of a division on the Jordan front in the Six Day War, and that is how Iraqi television was broadcasting pictures of 9 hanging Jewish corpses, among them my husband Fuad, all innocent people. The loudspeakers announced that from 4 o'clock that afternoon, the bodies would be brought down so that the mob could deal with them in the streets (ooit iets meer barbaars gehoord of gezien sinds de Nazi's). I returned to Basra and people, including Jews, avoided me for fear of being linked with my husband's so-called activities.'

Mrs Gubbay then described how she fled to Israel with her children in July 1971.

Over 50 more Jews were, after 1969, executed or died through torture in jail. Martyrdom is, unfortunately, not a new phenomenon in Jewish history. But the Jewish People, because of its adherence to the eternal Torah, has acquired the characteristic of eternity. This is exemplified now by our beloved State of Israel and the survival of the Jewish People in all lands of freedom and democracy. May we go from strength to strength, mechayil lechayil.

Wat wil je hier nu mee zeggen? Omdat de Irakezen vroeger groffe dingen deden, is het in orde om er nu een paar uit te pikken en die naar believen wat te mishandelen?

Wanneer gaan we een paar Duitsers vangen?

dagallemaal 11 mei 2004 12:39
heb je al geantwoord op andere draad.

parcifal 11 mei 2004 13:39
Citaat:
Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Dejohan
Wanneer gaan we een paar Duitsers vangen?
Jaah!
Ik heb vanmorgen een touringcar van die mannen zien toekomen.
Ze zagen er allemaal goed doorvoed uit, zelfs een
beetje aan de vadsige kant dus ze vangen
wordt een piece of cake.

Ik heb een fototoestel en vulniszakken voor over hun kop
brengt gij een paar honden mee? 8)

tss. Dat is nu eens nie politiek correct hé....
en voor de eencelligen op het forum : DIT IS IRONIE.
('k schrijf het er expliciet bij want ik ken dat, morgen
quoten ze dat totaal uit zijn verband)

dagallemaal 11 mei 2004 13:45
Citaat:
Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door parcifal
Citaat:
Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Dejohan
Wanneer gaan we een paar Duitsers vangen?
Jaah!
Ik heb vanmorgen een touringcar van die mannen zien toekomen.
Ze zagen er allemaal goed doorvoed uit dus ze vangen
wordt een piece of cake.

Ik heb een fototoestel, brengt gij een paar honden mee? 8)

tss. Dat is nu eens nié politiek correct hé....
Welke honden bedoel je?

parcifal 11 mei 2004 13:49


Deze beestjes bijvoorbeeld.


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