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Oud 18 mei 2007, 15:06   #14001
bosstraat5
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het is duidelijk dat sommigen de protocollen nog niet hebben gelezen

Citaat:
PROTOCOL No. 1

1. ....Putting aside fine phrases we shall speak of the significance of each thought: by comparisons and deductions we shall throw light upon surrounding facts.


2. What I am about to set forth, then, is our system from the two points of view, that of ourselves and that of the GOYIM [i.e., non- Jews].


3. It must be noted that men with bad instincts are more in number than the good, and therefore the best results in governing them are attained by violence and terrorisation, and not by academic discussions. Every man aims at power, everyone would like to become a dictator if only he could, and rare indeed are the men who would not be willing to sacrifice the welfare of all for the sake of securing their own welfare.


4. What has restrained the beasts of prey who are called men? What has served for their guidance hitherto?


5. In the beginnings of the structure of society, they were subjected to brutal and blind force; after words - to Law, which is the same force, only disguised. I draw the conclusion that by the law of nature right lies in force.


6. Political freedom is an idea but not a fact. This idea one must know how to apply whenever it appears necessary with this bait of an idea to attract the masses of the people to one's party for the purpose of crushing another who is in authority. This task is rendered easier of the opponent has himself been infected with the idea of freedom, SO-CALLED LIBERALISM, and, for the sake of an idea, is willing to yield some of his power. It is precisely here that the triumph of our theory appears; the slackened reins of government are immediately, by the law of life, caught up and gathered together by a new hand, because the blind might of the nation cannot for one single day exist without guidance, and the new authority merely fits into the place of the old already weakened by liberalism.

GOLD


7. In our day the power which has replaced that of the rulers who were liberal is the power of Gold. Time was when Faith ruled. The idea of freedom is impossible of realization because no one knows how to use it with moderation. It is enough to hand over a people to self-government for a certain length of time for that people to be turned into a disorganized mob. From that moment on we get internecine strife which soon develops into battles between classes, in the midst of which States burn down and their importance is reduced to that of a heap of ashes.


8. Whether a State exhausts itself in its own convulsions, whether its internal discord brings it under the power of external foes - in any case it can be accounted irretrievable lost: IT IS IN OUR POWER. The despotism of Capital, which is entirely in our hands, reaches out to it a straw that the State, willy-nilly, must take hold of: if not - it goes to the bottom.


9. Should anyone of a liberal mind say that such reflections as the above are immoral, I would put the following questions: If every State has two foes and if in regard to the external foe it is allowed and not considered immoral to use every manner and art of conflict, as for example to keep the enemy in ignorance of plans of attack and defense, to attack him by night or in superior numbers, then in what way can the same means in regard to a worse foe, the destroyer of the structure of society and the commonweal, be called immoral and not permissible?


10. Is it possible for any sound logical mind to hope with any success to guide crowds by the aid of reasonable counsels and arguments, when any objection or contradiction, senseless though it may be, can be made and when such objection may find more favor with the people, whose powers of reasoning are superficial? Men in masses and the men of the masses, being guided solely by petty passions, paltry beliefs, traditions and sentimental theorems, fall a prey to party dissension, which hinders any kind of agreement even on the basis of a perfectly reasonable argument. Every resolution of a crowd depends upon a chance or packed majority, which, in its ignorance of political secrets, puts forth some ridiculous resolution that lays in the administration a seed of anarchy.


11. The political has nothing in common with the moral. The ruler who is governed by the moral is not a skilled politician, and is therefore unstable on his throne. He who wishes to rule must have recourse both to cunning and to make-believe. Great national qualities, like frankness and honesty, are vices in politics, for they bring down rulers from their thrones more effectively and more certainly than the most powerful enemy. Such qualities must be the attributes of the kingdoms of the GOYIM, but we must in no wise be guided by them.
to be continued if necessary...

Laatst gewijzigd door bosstraat5 : 18 mei 2007 om 15:08.
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Oud 18 mei 2007, 15:18   #14002
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IlluSionS667 beschuldigt mij van leugens, en wanneer ik hem uitdaag daar links voor te geven, krijg ik het volgende voorbeeld:

Ik heb geschreven, als reactie op Pindar's (eigenlijk Rense's) bewering dat een Amerikaans officieel document de Protocollen voor echt hield:
Citaat:
Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Firestone Bekijk bericht
Ook nu weer komt Pindar af met de interpretatie van de antisemitische website Rense. Het volstaat de eigenlijke documenten te lezen om te zien dat Rense er zoals gebruikelijk naast zit.
Dit is volgens IlluSionS667 een leugen omdat er in het document het volgende staat:
Citaat:
It is not the purpose of this memorandum to make any argument toward establishing their genuineness. As previously stated, [hand written insert illegible] the Protocols are attributed to Herzl himself and one certainly must note the identity of thought found in the Protocols on the one hand and in Herzl’s public writings, and in the writings of other prominent past and contemporary Jewish leaders on the other.

Er staat, en ik herhaal het graag: "It is not the purpose of this memorandum to make any argument toward establishing their genuineness." Daarna wordt verwezen naar de hypothese dat Herzl de Protocollen heeft geschreven.

Believers zouden eens moeten leren een tekst correct te begrijpen. Rense lukt het hier niet, Pindar en IlluSionS667 blijkbaar ook niet.
Wie hun fantaisistiche interpretaties terecht verwerpt worden dan leugens toegedicht! Te gek voor woorden, eigenlijk.

OK, ik heb de link naar de vorige discussie over de Protocollen gegeven. De posts spreken voor zich.
__________________
The method of science is tried and true. It is not perfect, it's just the best we have. And to abandon it, with its skeptical protocols is the pathway to a dark age. -- Carl Sagan

Laatst gewijzigd door Firestone : 18 mei 2007 om 15:20.
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Oud 18 mei 2007, 15:30   #14003
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Citaat:
RIGHT IS MIGHT

12. Our right lies in force. The word "right" is an abstract thought and proved by nothing. The word means no more than: Give me what I want in order that thereby I may have a proof that I am stronger than you.

13. Where does right begin? Where does it end?


14. In any State in which there is a bad organization of authority, an impersonality of laws and of the rulers who have lost their personality amid the flood of rights ever multiplying out of liberalism, I find a new right - to attack by the right of the strong, and to scatter to the winds all existing forces of order and regulation, to reconstruct all institutions and to become the sovereign lord of those who have left to us the rights of their power by laying them down voluntarily in their liberalism.

15. Our power in the present tottering condition of all forms of power will be more invincible than any other, because it will remain invisible until the moment when it has gained such strength that no cunning can any longer undermine it.


16. Out of the temporary evil we are now compelled to commit will emerge the good of an unshakable rule, which will restore the regular course of the machinery of the national life, brought to naught by liberalism. The result justifies the means. Let us, however, in our plans, direct our attention not so much to what is good and moral as to what is necessary and useful.


17. Before us is a plan in which is laid down strategically the line from which we cannot deviate without running the risk of seeing the labor of many centuries brought to naught.


18. In order to elaborate satisfactory forms of action it is necessary to have regard to the rascality, the slackness, the instability of the mob, its lack of capacity to understand and respect the conditions of its own life, or its own welfare. It must be understood that the might of a mob is blind, senseless and un- reasoning force ever at the mercy of a suggestion from any side. The blind cannot lead the blind without bringing them into the abyss; consequently, members of the mob, upstarts from the people even though they should be as a genius for wisdom, yet having no understanding of the political, cannot come forward as leaders of the mob without bringing the whole nation to ruin.


19. Only one trained from childhood for independent rule can have understanding of the words that can be made up of the political alphabet.


20. A people left to itself, i.e., to upstarts from its midst, brings itself to ruin by party dissensions excited by the pursuit of power and honors and the disorders arising therefrom. Is it possible for the masses of the people calmly and without petty jealousies to form judgment, to deal with the affairs of the country, which cannot be mixed up with personal interest? Can they defend themselves from an external foe? It is unthinkable; for a plan broken up into as many parts as there are heads in the mob, loses all homogeneity, and thereby becomes unintelligible and impossible of execution.

WE ARE DESPOTS


21. It is only with a despotic ruler that plans can be elaborated extensively and clearly in such a way as to distribute the whole properly among the several parts of the machinery of the State: from this the conclusion is inevitable that a satisfactory form of government for any country is one that concentrates in the hands of one responsible person. Without an absolute despotism there can be no existence for civilization which is carried on not by the masses but by their guide, whosoever that person may be. The mob is savage, and displays its savagery at every opportunity. The moment the mob seizes freedom in its hands it quickly turns to anarchy, which in itself is the highest degree of savagery.


22. Behold the alcoholic animals, bemused with drink, the right to an immoderate use of which comes along with freedom. It is not for us and ours to walk that road. The peoples of the GOYIM are bemused with alcoholic liquors; their youth has grown stupid on classicism and from early immorality, into which it has been inducted by our special agents - by tutors, lackeys, governesses in the houses of the wealthy, by clerks and others, by our women in the places of dissipation frequented by the GOYIM. In the number of these last I count also the so-called "society ladies," voluntary followers of the others in corruption and luxury.


23. Our countersign is - Force and Make-believe. Only force conquers in political affairs, especially if it be concealed in the talents essential to statesmen. Violence must be the principle, and cunning and make-believe the rule for governments which do not want to lay down their crowns at the feet of agents of some new power. This evil is the one and only means to attain the end, the good. Therefore we must not stop at bribery, deceit and treachery when they should serve towards the attainment of our end. In politics one must know how to seize the property of others without hesitation if by it we secure submission and sovereignty.


24. Our State, marching along the path of peaceful conquest, has the right to replace the horrors of war by less noticeable and more satisfactory sentences of death, necessary to maintain the terror which tends to produce blind submission. Just but merciless severity is the greatest factor of strength in the State: not only for the sake of gain but also in the name of duty, for the sake of victory, we must keep to the programme of violence and make-believe. The doctrine of squaring accounts is precisely as strong as the means of which it makes use. Therefore it is not so much by the means themselves as by the doctrine of severity that we shall triumph and bring all governments into subjection to our super-government. It is enough for them to know that we are too merciless for all disobedience to cease.
to be continued if necessary...

Laatst gewijzigd door bosstraat5 : 18 mei 2007 om 15:31.
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Oud 18 mei 2007, 16:09   #14004
IlluSionS667
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Citaat:
Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Firestone Bekijk bericht
Er staat, en ik herhaal het graag: "It is not the purpose of this memorandum to make any argument toward establishing their genuineness."
Inderdaad. Het document gaat er vanuit dat de Protocollen echt zijn
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Oud 18 mei 2007, 17:39   #14005
Pindar
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well well well

it IS a strange world after all.


Citaat:
The Nazis Won!

According to information I have just received from Europe, KGB and former East German Stasi Secret Intelligence documents reveal that German Chancellor Angela Merkel is the daughter of Adolf Hitler and Gretl, Eva braun's youngest sister.


Apparently, the Nazis were experimenting with cryogenics and freezing sperm which they took and saved from Hitler. When the Soviets invaded Germany at the end of the war, this wound up in their hands. A complicated experiment ensued and Gretl was brought to East Germany and impregnated by Hitler's sperm.



Angela was born on her father's birthday, April 20, 1954, not in July as records indicate. This was also done under Vatican auspices and their Lutheran connections in East Germany.



It is a long and complicated story, but was set up to have her rule Europe when a Nazi pope takes office. Now, as her father wished, Europe is totally controlled by her and Germany. Merkel wants a European Constitution in effect by June 2009, effectively destroying any European country's sovereignty.



In addition, she is also having Britain dismantled under this new EU Constitution and removing British independence--supposedly signed by the Queen without public knowledge.



Plus, I have also received information indicating that the Bush family was also a Nazi creation to destroy the United States. That plan seems to be working quite well. The Bush family history is not what is in public records. In fact, George Sr. may be the son of Nikola Tesla's assistant, last name of Scherff.


Pin d'Ar
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Oud 18 mei 2007, 17:45   #14006
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Citaat:
Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Pindar Bekijk bericht
well well well

it IS a strange world after all.






Pin d'Ar
Krijgt La Chunga toch nog gelijk..
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Oud 18 mei 2007, 17:59   #14007
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Citaat:
Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door IlluSionS667 Bekijk bericht
Inderdaad. Het document gaat er vanuit dat de Protocollen echt zijn
Nope.

Dat is wat jij en Pindar, in navolging van Rense, er van maken. Er staat in dat document helemaal niet dat de Protocollen authentiek zijn, en dat was de oorsponkelijke bewering van Pindar. Fout dus.

Het is overigens vreemd dat Rense met deze zever ineens uitpakt.
Het document is 34 jaar geleden publiek gemaakt en zes jaar geleden door "Papurec" gepubliceerd. Het heeft ook twee jaar geleden op Stormfront gestaan. (Altijd in de veronderstelling dat het document echt is. Voorlopig ga ik daar van uit.)

Hoe dan ook, nergens staat in dat document dat de Protocollen authentiek zijn.
En dat de Protocollen een ordinaire vervalsing zijn is al lang geleden overtuigend bewezen. Zie de discussie hierover van enkele maanden geleden.
__________________
The method of science is tried and true. It is not perfect, it's just the best we have. And to abandon it, with its skeptical protocols is the pathway to a dark age. -- Carl Sagan

Laatst gewijzigd door Firestone : 18 mei 2007 om 18:03.
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Oud 18 mei 2007, 18:01   #14008
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Citaat:
Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Pindar Bekijk bericht
well well well

it IS a strange world after all.
Copy-paste van zever, zonder zelfs een bronvermelding. Inderdaad een "strange world" ...

Dit is overigens wel leuk:
Citaat:
Plus, I have also received information indicating that the Bush family was also a Nazi creation to destroy the United States.
In totale tegenspraak met de "Prescot Bush"-verhaaltjes.

Ach, believers zijn blijkbaar niet gehouden aan banale begrippen als bewijzen en consistentie. Da's voor lemmings ...
__________________
The method of science is tried and true. It is not perfect, it's just the best we have. And to abandon it, with its skeptical protocols is the pathway to a dark age. -- Carl Sagan

Laatst gewijzigd door Firestone : 18 mei 2007 om 18:07.
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Oud 19 mei 2007, 00:05   #14009
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bedankt voor samenvatting van de protocollen van zion van Robin de ruiter
Was nieuwsgierig ernaar
Sommigen beweren dat de riots in noord ierland oefenterrein waren voor de "jeugdcriminaliteit"
Ik beweer al jaren uit eigen aanvoelen dat bv france een tijdbom is in de banleius....
zo uitzichtloos en ontzield als die zijn bijna kazernes....
?
Toffe reportage bij eenvandaag over her kweken van algen...
Er is overdaad op deze planeet....
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Oud 19 mei 2007, 00:59   #14010
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Citaat:
Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Antoon Bekijk bericht
Toontje zou best maar eens een toontje lager gaan zingen!

De stichter van zijn Christian(???) Broadcasting Network schreef namelijk al in 1991 de bestseller The New World Order. Niet toevallig een bestseller, want heel dat NWO-gedoe is één grote lucratieve commercie die erin slaagt het ernstige - en dus iets minder goed verkopende - antiglobalisme belachelijk te maken.

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Oud 19 mei 2007, 14:05   #14011
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Citaat:
Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Pindar Bekijk bericht
The Nazis Won!

According to information I have just received from Europe, KGB and former East German Stasi Secret Intelligence documents reveal that German Chancellor Angela Merkel is the daughter of Adolf Hitler and Gretl, Eva braun's youngest sister.

Apparently, the Nazis were experimenting with cryogenics and freezing sperm which they took and saved from Hitler. When the Soviets invaded Germany at the end of the war, this wound up in their hands. A complicated experiment ensued and Gretl was brought to East Germany and impregnated by Hitler's sperm.

Angela was born on her father's birthday, April 20, 1954, not in July as records indicate. This was also done under Vatican auspices and their Lutheran connections in East Germany.

It is a long and complicated story, but was set up to have her rule Europe when a Nazi pope takes office. Now, as her father wished, Europe is totally controlled by her and Germany. Merkel wants a European Constitution in effect by June 2009, effectively destroying any European country's sovereignty.

In addition, she is also having Britain dismantled under this new EU Constitution and removing British independence--supposedly signed by the Queen without public knowledge.

Plus, I have also received information indicating that the Bush family was also a Nazi creation to destroy the United States. That plan seems to be working quite well. The Bush family history is not what is in public records. In fact, George Sr. may be the son of Nikola Tesla's assistant, last name of Scherff.


Was het maar waar

Waar haal je toch die onzin vandaan?

Citaat:
Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Firestone Bekijk bericht
Dat is wat jij en Pindar, in navolging van Rense, er van maken. Er staat in dat document helemaal niet dat de Protocollen authentiek zijn, en dat was de oorsponkelijke bewering van Pindar. Fout dus.
Er staat letterlijk dat de geciteerde woorden van het document de authenticiteit niet in twijfel trekt en van haar authenticiteit uitgaat. Ofwel ben je gewoon in denial ofwel moet je dringend je Engels eens oppoetsen.

Citaat:
Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Firestone Bekijk bericht
Het is overigens vreemd dat Rense met deze zever ineens uitpakt.
Het document is 34 jaar geleden publiek gemaakt en zes jaar geleden door "Papurec" gepubliceerd. Het heeft ook twee jaar geleden op Stormfront gestaan. (Altijd in de veronderstelling dat het document echt is. Voorlopig ga ik daar van uit.)
Voor mij was dit document nieuw en voor de meesten op dit forum waarschijnlijk ook. Het is opmerkelijk dat jij dit soort details allemaal weet, maar dat je tegelijk compleet in denial bent. Ik vraag mij af of jij geen pionnetje van de staatsveiligheid bent

Citaat:
Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Firestone Bekijk bericht
Hoe dan ook, nergens staat in dat document dat de Protocollen authentiek zijn.
En dat de Protocollen een ordinaire vervalsing zijn is al lang geleden overtuigend bewezen. Zie de discussie hierover van enkele maanden geleden.
Iedereen die zonder vooroordelen die discussie leest, kan niet ander concluderen dan dat de valsheid van de Protocollen nooit is aangetoond. Eveneens kan iedereen bij het lezen van de door Pindar aangehaalde documenten merken dat de Amerikanen in 1919 in haar authenticiteit geloofden.
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Oud 19 mei 2007, 14:31   #14012
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Citaat:
Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Volksstormer Bekijk bericht
De stichter van zijn Christian(???) Broadcasting Network schreef namelijk al in 1991 de bestseller The New World Order. Niet toevallig een bestseller, want heel dat NWO-gedoe is één grote lucratieve commercie die erin slaagt het ernstige - en dus iets minder goed verkopende - antiglobalisme belachelijk te maken.

Ik zou zo ver niet gaan. Uiteraard zijn er heel was disinformanten en bedriegerd die goed geld verdienen aan het schrijven van allerlei onzin over dit onderwerp (waar iemand als Pindar met open ogen intrapt), maar dat betekent niet dat de NWO één grote fabel is. Er zijn té veel historische aanwijzingen die het tegendeel aantonen.
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Oud 19 mei 2007, 16:19   #14013
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Citaat:
Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Volksstormer Bekijk bericht
Toontje zou best maar eens een toontje lager gaan zingen!

De stichter van zijn Christian(???) Broadcasting Network schreef namelijk al in 1991 de bestseller The New World Order. Niet toevallig een bestseller, want heel dat NWO-gedoe is één grote lucratieve commercie die erin slaagt het ernstige - en dus iets minder goed verkopende - antiglobalisme belachelijk te maken.

Het boek van Pat Roberston is een desinformatie boek. Roberston is "in the know". In zijn boek mixt hij ware feiten met leugens. Roberston is al helemaal geen Christian en ook een vrijmetselaar.



Hier staat hij op de cover van time een vrijmetselaarsclauw te doen:




SIGN OF A FELLOW CRAFT MASON
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Yesterday I was clever, so I wanted to change the world. Today I am wise, so I am changing myself. – Rumi

Laatst gewijzigd door exodus : 19 mei 2007 om 16:20.
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Oud 19 mei 2007, 16:41   #14014
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Citaat:
Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door IlluSionS667 Bekijk bericht
Er staat letterlijk dat de geciteerde woorden van het document de authenticiteit niet in twijfel trekt en van haar authenticiteit uitgaat. Ofwel ben je gewoon in denial ofwel moet je dringend je Engels eens oppoetsen.
Nope. Dat staat er niet.
Je kan uiteraard altijd het volledig citaat geven waar in dat document beweerd wordt dat de de Protocollen authentiek zijn.
Wat er wèl staat is dat de authenticiteit van de Protocollen ter discussie staat en dat het niet de bedoeling van de studie is deze authenticiteit vast te stellen.

Iedereen kan dat gewoon in de tekst lezen. Je moet dringend het onderscheid leren maken tussen jouw hersenspinsels en de realiteit.

Enkele relevante citaten:
Citaat:
Among the more important points around which controversy has waged are:

I. The authenticity of the so-called Jewish Protocols, which purport to set forth a Jewish plan, centuries old, of world domination.
...
It is not the purpose of this memorandum to make any argument toward establishing their genuineness.
Citaat:
Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door IlluSionS667 Bekijk bericht
Voor mij was dit document nieuw en voor de meesten op dit forum waarschijnlijk ook. Het is opmerkelijk dat jij dit soort details allemaal weet, maar dat je tegelijk compleet in denial bent. Ik vraag mij af of jij geen pionnetje van de staatsveiligheid bent
Jouw beledigingen en smerige insinuaties laten volgen door een smiley is laf.
Je bent niet de eerste believer die wie zijn verzinsels de prullenbak inwerkt voor agent van de staatsveiligheid uitscheldt. Uiteraard als "grapje".

Het soort "grapje" dat vooral jouw gebrek aan argumenten en bewijzen moet verdoezelen.
We zijn het inmiddels gewoon, hoor.

Citaat:
Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door IlluSionS667 Bekijk bericht
Iedereen die zonder vooroordelen die discussie leest, kan niet ander concluderen dan dat de valsheid van de Protocollen nooit is aangetoond. Eveneens kan iedereen bij het lezen van de door Pindar aangehaalde documenten merken dat de Amerikanen in 1919 in haar authenticiteit geloofden.
We hebben hier te maken met de bij believers gebruikelijke techniek van omkering van de bewijslast. Het is aan jullie te bewijzen dat de Protocollen authentiek zijn, niet omgekeerd. Dat is jullie nooit gelukt.
De valsheid van de Protocollen is overigens al in de jaren 1920 aangetoond. Jij wil dat niet aannemen omdat het jouw geloof tegenspreekt. Op de zelfde wijze dat je verzint dat het document uit 1919 de Protocollen voor authentiek verklaart. Quod non.
__________________
The method of science is tried and true. It is not perfect, it's just the best we have. And to abandon it, with its skeptical protocols is the pathway to a dark age. -- Carl Sagan

Laatst gewijzigd door Firestone : 19 mei 2007 om 16:53.
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Oud 19 mei 2007, 17:25   #14015
IlluSionS667
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Citaat:
Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Firestone Bekijk bericht
Je kan uiteraard altijd het volledig citaat geven waar in dat document beweerd wordt dat de de Protocollen authentiek zijn.
Ik heb meermaals de uitspraak geciteerd waarin letterlijk wordt gesteld dat de opstellers van het document de protocollen de authenticiteit veronderstellen.

Als je op die manier verder blijft discussiëren, count me out
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Oud 19 mei 2007, 18:36   #14016
Heftruck
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Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Firestone Bekijk bericht
Jouw beledigingen en smerige insinuaties laten volgen door een smiley is laf.
Wie de bal kaatst..

Grappig trouwens hoe je IlluSionS667 dingen verwijt die je zelf doet. Iets van pot, ketel en zwart zien. Maar dat heb ik al een aantal kunnen stellen..

Citaat:
Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Firestone Bekijk bericht
Je bent niet de eerste believer die wie zijn verzinsels de prullenbak inwerkt voor agent van de staatsveiligheid uitscheldt. Uiteraard als "grapje". ==> <==
  • Jouw beledigingen en smerige insinuaties
  • laten volgen door een smiley is laf.
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Oud 19 mei 2007, 18:51   #14017
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Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door IlluSionS667 Bekijk bericht
Ik heb meermaals de uitspraak geciteerd waarin letterlijk wordt gesteld dat de opstellers van het document de protocollen de authenticiteit veronderstellen.
Nope, jij hebt zo'n uitspraak niet geciteerd.

De discussie begon hier. Iedereen kan gemakkelijk nalezen dat er nergens een citaat staat waaruit blijkt dat het document uit 1919 de Protocollen voor authentiek hield.

Ik heb wel in mijn vorige post de citaten gegeven waaruit net blijkt dat het document zich over de authenticiteit niet uitspreekt.

Ik geef mijn bewijzen, jij niet.
Hoe zou dat toch komen?


Citaat:
Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door IlluSionS667 Bekijk bericht
Als je op die manier verder blijft discussiëren, count me out


Believers en aanverwanten hebben het moeilijk met mensen die hun beweringen kunnen staven en die ongefundeerde zever niet zomaar slikken.
Dit blijkt hier voor de zoveelste keer.

Case closed.

(Tot de volgende keer dat Pindar met zijn geliefde Protocollen afkomt. )
__________________
The method of science is tried and true. It is not perfect, it's just the best we have. And to abandon it, with its skeptical protocols is the pathway to a dark age. -- Carl Sagan

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Oud 19 mei 2007, 18:51   #14018
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sorry, foutje ...
__________________
The method of science is tried and true. It is not perfect, it's just the best we have. And to abandon it, with its skeptical protocols is the pathway to a dark age. -- Carl Sagan

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Oud 19 mei 2007, 19:57   #14019
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The Interview with
Harold Wallace Rosenthal

The following text is from a booklet called The Hidden Tyranny.
Harold Rosenthal was supposedly murdered for giving this interview in 1976 during which he boasted about how a group of Jews are manipulating the stupid and gullible Goyim.

As with the Protocols of Zion, many Jews claim that Rosenthal's interview is yet another hoax created by those mysterious and elusive anti-Semites.

However, as with the Protocols of Zion, what Rosenthal says seems to be true, so hoax or not, it is important to look at it.

Example: Rosenthal said "Your people don't have guts." Our cowardly friends, policemen, and neighbors are proof of that accusation! They run from 9/11 like children frightened of a dark room.

Other accurate remarks from Rosenthal:

• Anytime truth comes forth which exposes us, we simply rally our forces -- the ignorant Christians. They attack the crusaders even if they are members of their own families. • We virtually get away with murder, and all the goy do is to talk about it, which is ineffective since we, the masters of propaganda, always publish a contradicting account.






INTRODUCTION


This booklet contains the text of a most revealing and shocking interview of a Jew by the name of Harold Rosenthal, which was conducted in 1976, by a concerned patriot, a Walter White, Jr.. Mr. Rosenthal, an influential Jew, learned in the Jewish ways and involved in the workings of government in Washington, D.C., explained the Jewish involvement and cause of the major problems we face today.
The Anti-defamation League(ADL) of B'nai B'rith, a Zionist organization[/b], claims the tapes are a forgery and offer as evidence that "White failed to explain why he would wait to first publish the booklet until 1978, [two] years after he had "spoken" with Rosenthal, who was killed by terrorists in 1976." As usual, the Zionists must reach beyond logic to attempt to dismiss revealing information about Talmudic Zionism

Rosenthal, in exposing certain aspects of the 'inner invisible world of Jewry', revealed the modes and tactics Jews have used in destroying Christian civilization and covertly attaining control over our lives and governments. The result has been a 'hidden tyranny' upon us like the tyranny waged against the Saints by the red beast system of Revelation referred to as 'Mystery Babylon'.

But how could such a small number of Jews enslave so many people and gain such an overwhelming control over their governments, especially without their being aware of it?

The answer to this may be found in Christ's parable of the unjust steward, which represents Jewry. They are able to prevail in the world despite their ungodly ways because of their cunning and shrewd ways. As Christ said "For the children of this world are in their generation wiser than the children of light." (Luke 16:8)

In other words, the Jew, with his worldly mind set, is wiser than God's Christian people. When you read the words of Mr. Rosenthal the reality of this statement will come to light.

This problem was so prevalent and important for us to overcome that Christ had instructed us to "be wise as serpents". (Matthew 10:16)

America and the world is now covered in political, economic, moral and social problems which need to be acted upon by Christian people. As Edmund Burke stated: The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing." But before we can properly act we need a proper (not just a superficial) understanding of the problem. This booklet will help provide the reader with that understanding.

--Charles A. Weisman June, 1992

The Hidden Tyranny
Part One

In a highly confidential interview with a Jewish administrative assistant to one of this nation's ranking senators, Jacob Javits R-NY, he said,

"It is a marvel that the American people do not rise up and drive every Jew out of this country."

Mr. Harold Wallace Rosenthal, made this statement after admitting Jewish dominance in all significant national programs. He said,

"We Jews continue to be amazed with the ease by which Christian Americans have fallen into our hands. While the naive Americans wait for Khrushchev to bury them, we have taught them to submit to our every demand."

Asked how a nation could be captured without their knowing it, Mr. Rosenthal attributed this victory to absolute control of the media. He boasted of Jewish control of ALL NEWS. Any newspaper which refused to acquiesce to controlled news was brought to its knees by withdrawing advertising.

Failing in this, the Jews stop the supply of news print and ink. "It's a very simple matter," he stated.

Asked about men in high political office, Mr Rosenthal said that no one in the last three decades has achieved any political power without Jewish approval. "Americans have not had a presidential choice since 1932. Roosevelt was our man; every president since Roosevelt has been our man."

In a discussion about George Wallace, Mr. Rosenthal smiled and suggested that we note where Wallace stands today.

When the U.S. foreign policy was mentioned, the bedroom confidence of the interview was all but set aside. With disdain and mockery he sneered at the American stupidity in failing to see through the entire scope of Kissinger's foreign policy.

"It is Zionist-Communist policy from beginning to end. Yet the citizens think this Jewish policy will benefit America." He cited "detente" and Angola as examples of Jewish diplomacy. The credulous nature of Americans drew only contempt from him.

The interview continued on an almost omniscient plane. [COLOR="Blue"]"We Jews have put issue upon issue to the American people. Then we promote both sides of the issue as confusion reigns. With their eye's fixed on the issues, they fail to see who is behind every scene. We Jews toy with the American public as a cat toys with a mouse." [/color]
As the conversation went on into the late hours, one could sense that perhaps America deserves the reign of terror being planned for her.

The Jewish mind pits every ethnic group against the other. "The blood of the masses will flow as we wait for our day of world victory," Mr. Rosenthal said coldly.

For hours after this incredible discussion, a sense of inadequacy prevailed. Is it possible that another group of "human being" could be so treacherous in spirit, so evil in intent? Yet, the words heard and the evidence at hand are real.

Is it possible that the American people can remain docile, even while their life's blood is being drained from them? It seems so.

WHAT DOES ALL THIS SAY TO US? Since what you have just read plus the lengthy inerview that followed, Mr. Harold Wallace Rosenthal, age 29, the administrative assistant to Senator Jacob K. Javits of New York was killed in an alleged sky-jacking attempt on an Israeli airliner in Istanbul, Turkey, August 12, 1976.

It would appear that Mr. Rosenthal might have "talked too freely" because although four people were killed and some 30 injured during the sky-jacking attempt, Rosenthal was not killed by a random bullet as were the others.


This writer and editor is not easily shocked but as this egotist Harold W. Rosenthal raved on and on I found so much of what he said actually horrifying the actual betrayal of which he admittedly was a part and he appeared to gloat over the apparent success of a Jewish World Conspiracy.

This, mind you, comes from an "administrative assistant" to one of our ranking Senator's, Jacob K. Javits of New York.

What you are about to read should act as a WARNING to all non-Jews throughout the world. It hopefully should open the eyes of many who knew him in Washington government circles.

It becomes indeed obvious that what he discloses is not fiction. It is not imagination! He was not pretending as he spoke with knowledge and intelligence.

Many things have been said and written about the One World Jewish Conspiracy but never has it been described so openly. It staggers the imagination.

Their plans are shocking and many will be astonished at the contents of this document. NOTHING like it has ever been told before. We prefer not to elaborate. You be the judge.

Looking back to the time of this interview and having had time to analyze Harold Rosenthal's candidness, we are compelled to think of him as a conceited, boastful yet very knowledgeable person. I would classify him as an egotist and a egoist.

At times his cruelty surfaced with a venom, especially as he describes the STUPID CHRISTIANS or "goys" as he so often referred to "us."

This surprised me because the word "goy" is not in our language and he must have known this. His mind was thoroughly immersed in the ONE-WORLD PLAN of World Jewry.

With arrogance, he boasted that the Jew's conquest of the world was almost complete thanks to Christian stupidity. When asked if he was a Zionist, Mr.. Rosenthal replied:

"That's a hell of a question! At the foundation of the issue is the traditional Zionist concept of aliyah, a Hebrew term meaning the 'in gathering' or return of Diaspora L.(dispersed Jews) Jews to the Palestine homeland. Ever since 1948 and the creation of the State of Israel, aliyah has become a basic imperative of Israeli government policy."

What is aliyah? Will you please spell it for me? He did so and we inquired as to the realistic meaning of aliyah. Mr.. Rosenthal said:

"It is a permanent physical migration to Palestine, not just a visit. "We asked, what is Zionism? I've heard Jews define it as anything from permanent migration to financial spiritual support of Israel from around the world.

Mr. Rosenthal replied: "Our first leader, former Prime Minister David Ben-Gurion, said that Zionism without a 'return to Zion' is phony. Not many American Jews migrate permanently to Israel. Some say that all Jews, by definition, are Zionists. Others say that a Jew is not a Zionist unless he's a member who pays dues to an actively Zionist organization. Definitions have been tossed everywhere since the Jewish homeland became a reality."

Millions of tax-exempt American dollars are sent to Israel yearly and we true American do not like this. Mr. Rosenthal replied: "the naive politicians in Washington are gullible. Most of them are not too bright so the powerful Jewish lobbyists influenced this practice years ago and there is no one strong enough to stop it.

Some of the money is even returned to the United States and spent on Zionist propaganda efforts, much of it through the B'nai B'rith and the Conference of Jewish Organizations and the World Jewish Congress.

The Jewish Agency is a funding arm, a sort of body of B'nai B'rith officials. There is nothing wrong with sending American dollars to Israel tax-free so long as we are smart enough to get away with it.

Let's reverse this conversation for a minute. You made it clear and quite vociferously, that you don't like Jews. Why do you hate us?"

Mr. Rosenthal I do not hate anybody. I said I hate what the Jews are doing to us and especially as it relates to any and everything related to Christianity. I hate their deceit, trickery, cunning and their detestable dishonesty. Does that make me anti-Semitic? If it does then I am anti-Semitic!!

"Anti-Semitism does not signify opposition to Semitism. There is no such thing. It is an expression we Jews use effectively as a smear word used to brand as a bigot, like you guys, anyone who brings criticism against Jews. We use it against hate-mongers."

It was made clear that I despised the Jews corruptive influence on our Christian culture and on our properly Christ-oriented American way of life, to which Mr. Rosenthal said: "During Christ's time, the Jews were seeking a material and earthly kingdom but Christ offered the Jews a spiritual kingdom. This, they couldn't buy, so they rejected Jesus Christ and had him crucified."

What do you mean had him crucified? Doesn't history prove that the Jews crucified Jesus Christ? To which he answered: "Yes, I guess they did. I don't beat around the bush but 2,000 years ago your people would have done the same thing to a man who mistreated them as Christ did the Jews."

You speak of Jesus Christ as merely a man.


"That's all he was--a man who walked on the Earth like any other man and this myth about Christ rising from the dead and returning to Earth to visit with his disciples is a bunch of crap. The Jews who drove the Arabs out of Palestine did so to disprove Christ's mission for a spiritual kingdom. You see, instead of a leader who would make an empire for the Jews, your kind of people gave the Jews a peaceful preacher called Christ who instead of an eye-for-an-eye turns the other cheek. Rubbish! We are building and, in fact, have built an earthly empire without your kind and your disappointing Messiah."

I can see that it is you and your kind who try to get Christ out of Christmas. I feel sorry for you... to which he quickly replied:

"Don't give me that shit. I don't want your pity. I don't need it! Too many Jews do not have the guts to tell you how we live and plan, but I am not intimidated by anyone or anything. I know where I'm going."

We asked why do Jews frequently change their names he said:

"Jews are the most intelligent people in the world so if it benefits them to change their name they do so. That's all there is to it. They mix in your society which is plenty corrupt so while the Jews are benefiting themselves the the dumb goy doesn't realize that these Jews with non-Jew names are Jews. I know what you are thinking about Jews in government who use non-Jew names. Well don't be concerned because in the foreseeable future there will be no Presidential power in the United States. The invisible government is taking strength in that direction."


To your knowledge, are the Jews in Russia really persecuted or are they given any kind of freedom? To which he said:

"Most Jews throughout the world, I'd say more than 90%, know what is really happening to our people. We have communication unequalled anywhere. It is only the jerks, the ignorant and misinformed and degenerates who can find peace in your society and you bastards hide your sins by donning sheep's clothing. You are the hypocrites not the Jews, as you say and write about.
To answer your question in Russia, there are two distinct governments one visible and the other invisible. The visible is made up of different nationalities, whereas the invisible is composed of ALL JEWS.

The powerful Soviet Secret Police takes its orders from the invisible government. There are about six to seven million Communist in Soviet Russia, 50% are Jews and 50% are gentiles, but the gentiles are not trusted. The Communist Jews are united and trust each other, while the others spy on one another. About every five to six years the secret Jewish Board calls for the purge of the party and many are liquidated.

When asked "why"? he said:
"Because they begin to understand too much about the Jewish secret government. Russian Communists have a Secret Group Order which consists of Jews only. They rule over everything pertaining to the visible government. It was this powerful organization that was responsible for the secret removal of the center of Communism to Tel Aviv from where all instructions now originate."

Does our government and the United Nations have knowledge of this? He replied:

"The United Nations is nothing but a trap-door to the Red World's immense concentration camp. We pretty much control the U.N."
When asked why the Communists destroy the middle class or educated and their entire families when they invade a country Mr. Rosenthal replied:

"It is an established rule to destroy all members of pre-existing government, their families and relatives, but never Jews. They destroy all members of the police, state police, army officers and their families but never Jews. You see, we know when a government begins to search for the Communists within its borders they are really attempting to uncover Jews in their area. We're not fooled! The invisible rulers in the Communist countries have a world control over the propaganda and the governments in free countries. We control every media of expression including newspapers, magazines, radio and television. Even your music! We censor the songs released for publication long before they reach the publishers. Before long we will have complete control of your thinking."

The way you boast, if this is true, it is frightening to think about our future, and that of Christianity, to which Mr. Rosenthal said:


"There will be a forced class warfare here in the United States and many will be liquidated. You will unquestionably be among them. The Jews will not be harmed. I'm not boasting! I'm giving you the facts!
And it is too late for your Christian followers to put up a defense. That time is long past. Long, long ago we had to become the aggressors!! That is undoubtedly one of our great purposes in life. We are aggressors!! Because you stole your pretended religious beliefs from our Talmud."


After reminding him that we thought he was intelligent but now realize that he doesn't know what he was talking about he replied:

"Judaism is the unequaled culture -- with nothing, nothing anywhere in the world to compare with it. Your so-called Christianity is an outgrowth of Judaism. The cultural and intellectual influence of Judaism is felt throughout the entire world -- yes, throughout civilization."

When I asked whether he thought we faced a problem eventually with the Blacks because of their startling population increase he said that the Blacks are helping to serve 'our purpose' which might mean several things.

We discussed the Black invasion of city, county and state and their prominence now in television. Also how ridiculous it is for Blacks to become converted to Jews -- like Sammy Davis for instance. Mr. R. replied:

"That doesn't mean anything. We know that a Black cannot become a Jew and that Sammy Davis is still Black. It may have been to his advantage to become converted. In reality he still remains a nigger and not a Jew."

I told him of my in-depth study of the Jews and that there were few who have done more research on world Jewry than I -- and about my unpleasant discoveries -- reminding Mr. R. that there is no morality among Jews. He replied:

"Money is more important than morality. We can accomplish anything with money. Our people are proving that in Israel where its strength against attack is its permanent state of war readiness. Israel can now win in any encounter. The kibbutz-raised intellectual elements are going to build that small country into a mid-east wonderland. It will also eventually be the base for World Government Headquarters. "

We discussed the tragedy of Watergate and corruption at all levels of government and suggested that government representatives practice more openness and candor in dealing with the people. Mr. R. said:

"What good would it do? What the hell does the public know about the running of government. The great majority are asses -- horses asses!!"

May we quote you on that?

"I don't care: what you do -- as I said, few have the guts to speak out. We would all have better understanding between each other -- Jews and gentiles -- if we spoke out more openly. Your people don't have guts. We establish your thinking -- we even place within you a 'guilt complex' making you afraid to criticize Jewry openly."

lees verder

***

“It is essential that the sufferings of Jews. . . become worse. . . this will assist in realization of our plans. . .I have an excellent idea. . . I shall induce anti-semites to liquidate Jewish wealth. . . The anti-semites will assist us thereby in that they will strengthen the persecution and oppression of Jews. The anti-semites shall be our best friends”.

-- From Herzl's Diary (1897)


Theodor Herzl, Founder of Zionism

Laatst gewijzigd door bosstraat5 : 19 mei 2007 om 20:08.
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Oud 19 mei 2007, 23:33   #14020
Asshen Sukar
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Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door exodus Bekijk bericht
Het boek van Pat Roberston is een desinformatie boek. Roberston is "in the know". In zijn boek mixt hij ware feiten met leugens. Roberston is al helemaal geen Christian en ook een vrijmetselaar.



Hier staat hij op de cover van time een vrijmetselaarsclauw te doen:




SIGN OF A FELLOW CRAFT MASON
Mag ik vragen wat daar zo bezonder aan rechterhand op linkerborst is ?
Is dit niet een redelijk algemeen teken?

In "Enemy at the gates" komt die beweging ook voor. Net zoals in het fantasyboek Duisternis over Sethanon. Die 2 weet ik direct.
Voor de rest in heel wat films met als variant handpalm op linkerborst.

Volgens mij is dat toch een algemen militaire begroeting die je regelmatig tegenkomt.
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