De andere kant - Israel - Gaza

[Tamam]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Israëlisch

Hi Tamam

You are right! It does not, I was just trying to put things in proportions.
But bottom line Israel is no Belgium, We can not be super liberal and super free we always have to watch out back and have our guns ready, that it till we will have full peace.

The point is that under the circumstances that we are in I think that overall we do a good job!

Easy way out to blame your country undemocratic behavior on others. TAKE RESONSIBILITY and act like it. you don't. instead you try to justify things that are wrong. you're nothing but bad PR for Israel. you don't want anything to change, you think things are going pretty good. we roll our eyes about this cynicical apathy and blind patriotism.

look for example at this video, 3:22. an arab woman in the Israeli parliament getting shouted at.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xW0CMlqEDdE

how you can say you are doing a "good job" puzzles my mind.

[Cdude]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Israëlisch

Hi Eigenzinnig

And what would you have done if it was your city attacked by rockets on a daily bases for years?

No country in the world has the problem Israel face, but yet every one are judging us?

I find it funny, don't you?

Move away, push politicians for a SOLUTION not ESCALATION of the problem.

[Israëlisch]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Francientje

Is dat zo? Maar Hamas met alles erop en eraan werd toch democratisch
verkozen door die 1,3 miljoen mensen, niet?
Met andere woorden: Hamas is hun vertegenwoordiger en doet dus wat zij
willen dat het doet.

Hi Francientje

Hitler was also elected democratically!
Any democracy has the right to defend it self!
And Yes I find it sad that this is what the Palestinian wanted, you need to understand that what lead to there election was a disappointment from the Fatah and its corruption, not just an alternative way to fight Israel.

[Israëlisch]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Cdude

Move away, push politicians for a SOLUTION not ESCALATION of the problem.

Move a way back to were? Europe? will you be willing to let 7 millions Israelis in Belgium?
Hamas say that we have no right to exist there!

[Israëlisch]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Cdude

Move away, push politicians for a SOLUTION not ESCALATION of the problem.

PS, We do push our politicians to a solution (See the west bank) but who do you want us to talk in Gaza?

[RodeLantaarn]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Israëlisch

Hi RodeLantaarn!

Love your post!

Lts talk about a few facts:

1) the war was caused by Israel - What war are you talking about? the one in 67 when all the armies or the Arabs were tryng to kick us to the sea? (BTW and then we made the mistake of occupying the land) or the war that is going on since 89 Intifada? or maybe the last one that we did on 09 in Gaza that was precede by 8000 rockets?

8000 rockets that did hardly any damage compared to the destruction and bombardments that the Isralean army is capable of? It is pure suppression of a people based on illogical fear and indoctrination that there is a so-called 'clash of cultures' going on. The only clash is in the minds of people. Incited by propaganda by those who profit from it.

2)We deny them so much, but not everything, so it's okay? - I guess the next thing you will want us to send in to Gaza is the rockets to shoot at us!

Again BS. It's not because the Palestinians have more freedom that they automatically will turn to violence again. Besides, I'm quite sure that they know how to get weapons even with the blockade. Arms dealing is one of the most profitable 'jobs' that exist these days.

3)Hasbara troll - Well Like I said before I wish the "Hasbara trolls" were more like me, Again this is the reason that people like you think in such a one track mind. Sorry to disappoint you I am not Hasbara. Just some one who is trying to show you there are 2 sides to every coin.

I don't believe you. You haven't put yourself in the perspective of the Palestinian even once. I read that the Israelian ministry is devoted to campaining its propaganda on the internet. It is no surprise that suddenly you turn up after the incident, to 'show us the other side'. I already know that side. Also, I'm under the impression that you are using some kind of translation site.

[Dixie]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Israëlisch

Move a way back to were? Europe? will you be willing to let 7 millions Israelis in Belgium?
Hamas say that we have no right to exist there!

in exchange we can send al muslims who live in belgium to palestina everybody happy!

[Cdude]

Gerard Horton is an international lawyer for DCI. He said Mohammad's Ballasi's story is a familiar one. ''We see these stories again and again. Israel is a signatory to the UN convention against torture. It's also a signatory to the UN convention on the rights of the child - and under customary international law, it's not permissible to mistreat and torture, particularly children, who are obviously more vulnerable than adults."

He told me that Israel arrested 9,000 Palestinians last year. Seven hundred of those were children. Mr Horton says the military tribunals need to process cases quickly. DCI believes the system is designed so that it is in an adult or a child's interest to plead guilty. Gerard Horton says Palestinians tend to end up in jail longer if they try to fight their case.

Mohammad Khawaja had just turned 13 when he was arrested.
''They dragged me from my home by the scruff of the neck. The more I cried the more they choked me," he said.

"My mum was screaming. They pulled me along on my stomach. My knees were bleeding. They beat me with their guns and kicked me all the way to the jeep.
"They cuffed my hands and legs, blind-folded me and left me there for 24 hours. I thought I was going to die.

"Later interrogators wanted me to tell on other people. I wouldn't. They beat me with plastic chairs. They told me to sign a paper written in Hebrew. I don't read or speak it. Because I signed it they put me in jail.''

http://irish4palestine.blogspot.com/...peaks-out.html

[D'ARTOIS]

@ Israelisch

One of the major points is that many readers of this forum are not aware of is regarding an excisting official state of war between Israel and Gaza/Hamas.
Is this a formal state of war, announced as such or can we compare it with what the Germans executed in WWII - just enter a country and siege it?

In the first case, entering ships at open sea is completely at the risk of the attacker;
If the latter is the case, the entering/boartdiong of foreign ships is illegal - there is no way out.

In the first case, self defense is entirely justified;
In the latter case same - both parties are at war.

[Cdude]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door RodeLantaarn

3)Hasbara troll - Well Like I said before I wish the "Hasbara trolls" were more like me, Again this is the reason that people like you think in such a one track mind. Sorry to disappoint you I am not Hasbara. Just some one who is trying to show you there are 2 sides to every coin.

I don't believe you. You haven't put yourself in the perspective of the Palestinian even once. I read that the Israelian ministry is devoted to campaining its propaganda on the internet. It is no surprise that suddenly you turn up after the incident, to 'show us the other side'. I already know that side.[/quote]Or what we call : caught red handed

[Tamam]

anyone who comes here to say Israel is doing a pretty good job, is doing nothing but PR and sounds Hasbara automatically.

[Eigenzinnig]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Israëlisch

Hi Eigenzinnig

And what would you have done if it was your city attacked by rockets on a daily bases for years?

No country in the world has the problem Israel face, but yet every one are judging us?

I find it funny, don't you?

Sure kill at least 1.000 opponents for every injured Israëli victim and destroy hundreds of facilities for every hole in our land...just terrorise 1,3 miljoen people and then ask yoursefl...but why do they hate us so much..

[RodeLantaarn]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Tamam

anyone who comes here to say Israel is doing a pretty good job, is doing nothing but PR and sounds Hasbara automatically.

True, but I keep seeing the same, subjective arguments over and over.

[Cdude]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Eigenzinnig

Sure kill at least 1.000 opponents for every injured Israëli victim and destroy hundreds of facilities for every hole in our land...just terrorise 1,3 miljoen people and then ask yoursefl...but why do they hate us so much..

[Israëlisch]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door RodeLantaarn

8000 rockets that did hardly any damage compared to the destruction and bombardments that the Isralean army is capable of? It is pure suppression of a people based on illogical fear and indoctrination that there is a so-called 'clash of cultures' going on. The only clash is in the minds of people. Incited by propaganda by those who profit from it.

Again BS. It's not because the Palestinians have more freedom that they automatically will turn to violence again. Besides, I'm quite sure that they know how to get weapons even with the blockade. Arms dealing is one of the most profitable 'jobs' that exist these days.

I don't believe you. You haven't put yourself in the perspective of the Palestinian even once. I read that the Israelian ministry is devoted to campaining its propaganda on the internet. It is no surprise that suddenly you turn up after the incident, to 'show us the other side'. I already know that side. Also, I'm under the impression that you are using some kind of translation site.

1) so what you basically say is that if we will allow Hamas to kill more Israelis you will be on my side?
Can you imagine how it feels to live in a boomed city for 8 years?

2)the fact that they get weapons in other ways does not mean that we ned to make it easier

3)I don't need to put my self in the "perspective of the Palestinian" I see it every year when my government send me to the occupy territories, I know what they are suffering in the road block in with the fence, but still they are much better then they were before and they will get all they want if they will just sit to the table and talk.
Fact and point: Fatah got all that he has from sitting to the table with us, Egypt got all of Sinai from talking to us, Jordan got all that they wanted through the table.
So we have credentials already, we are not BS. All we want is for them to give us what we want. It is called negotiations!

[Tamam]

You come here to talk about "the other side", and all you do is try to justify warcrimes.. you have an uncritical approach to facts. You are apathetic about the thing happening with your own country.

What "other side" are you even talking about?

[Cdude]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Israëlisch

1) so what you basically say is that if we will allow Hamas to kill more Israelis you will be on my side?
Can you imagine how it feels to live in a boomed city for 8 years?

2)the fact that they get weapons in other ways does not mean that we ned to make it easier

3)I don't need to put my self in the "perspective of the Palestinian" I see it every year when my government send me to the occupy territories, I know what they are suffering in the road block in with the fence, but still they are much better then they were before and they will get all they want if they will just sit to the table and talk.
Fact and point: Fatah got all that he has from sitting to the table with us, Egypt got all of Sinai from talking to us, Jordan got all that they wanted through the table.
So we have credentials already, we are not BS. All we want is for them to give us what we want. It is called negotiations!

Bad bad Palestinians !!! Now go and stand in the corner till we decide u have suffered enough

[Israëlisch]

Guys,Thanks for the great time here,
Although all of you think this is my job "Hasbara troll"
It is not and I need to go to work.
I will check up later whats up here and will come back to talk some more.
I hope I did give you some thing to talk about.

Cheers.
and Thanks for now.

[Israëlisch]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Cdude

Bad bad Palestinians !!! Now go and stand in the corner till we decide u have suffered enough

you are making no point!!!

[Tamam]

Bye bye PR man.