Een van twee daders is Europees katholiek - Pagina 7

daiwa · 25 april 2006, 11:35

Citaat:

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door kaatd

Ze hebban één dader te pakken en ze weten dat de andere in Polen zit en nu gaat u zeggen dat de staat daders ongestraft wil laten?
.

Die vrees heeft de vader van Joe nochtans ook hoor.
Toruwens weet je dat de moordenaar die de schedel van Patrick Mombaerts doorboorde met een ijzeren staaf in eerste instantie slechts een berisping kreeg?
Nadien omdat het volk zo verontwaardigt reageerde kreeg hij een werkstraf.
Slechts een werkstraf om iemand te vermoorden.

Ondertussen is het gastje weer de criminele tour op gegaan.
Doe zo voort, blijf ze maar pamperen.

PollyCorrect · 25 april 2006, 11:37

Hoezo katholiek?
Je onderschat de islam in Polen nogal. Waarom zo'n vooroordeel?

Tartar Source
After six centuries, Poland's Muslims are still misunderstood
Wojtek Kość

The village's only street, tightly flanked by two rows of low wooden houses, leads past an insignificant green building, also made of wood. Walking through a pleasant yard, one has to negotiate a path between old cherry trees that lead up to the entrance door, where visitors often catche a glimpse of a crescent shape atop the building before knocking. A jovial keeper opens the door and gestures visitors inside. There are Koran verses on the walls. The keeper points out a window which faces distant Mecca: "You may even see it, if you look hard enough," he laughs.

Welcome to Bohoniki in eastern Poland. Bohoniki, and nearby Kruszyniany, are most often mentioned because of their mosques, quite an unlikely feature of a village in Poland.

An unknown minority

Bohoniki and Kruszyniany have been Tartar villages since the 17th century, when King Jan Sobieski III allowed Tartars to settle there as a reward for their loyal service. Descendants of those people still live there, which is evident in the Asian features of the Bohoniki keeper. However, he says, "Our original Tartar blood gets thinner and thinner." Yet the village mosques are still in operation, as Polish Muslims are not confined to these two villages, and they do not necessarily have to be Tartars, even though Tartars constitute the majority of Polish Muslims.

They are organized in six religious communities: Warsaw, Białystok, Bohoniki, Kruszyniany, Gdańsk, and Gorzów Wielkopolski. They have three mosques: an 18th century one in Kruszyniany, a mid-19th century one in Bohoniki and a new mosque built in Gdańsk in 1990. There are also prayer houses in Warsaw and Białystok. "It's very difficult to estimate the number of Muslims in Poland, because no census has been conducted thus far. A few years ago, the Polish Muslim Association intended to do it, but the questionnaire they came up with looked more like a police dossier than a declaration of religious creed," says Marek Szymanowicz, a Muslim from Kraków.

Misperception and misunderstanding

Abdulwahab Bouali, 31, takes care of the Białystok prayer house. He is a member of the Muslim Students Association in Poland, a union of followers of Islam from Muslim countries in the East who have come to Poland to study. Born in Algeria, he has lived in Poland for 14 years now and is a pilot who graduated of the Dęblin Aviation School.

"The prayer house I'm taking care of—and live in—will only serve its purpose until the mosque is built here in Białystok," he says. "What we're doing here is ensuring local Muslims get a chance to practice their faith. We also organize lectures for people of other creeds, because the picture of Islam they get from TV is distorted. It is associated with terrorism and a lack of rights for women, but the truth is that Islam is the only creed that does assure women true rights." The lectures, however, have been scarce, because the people that would potentially organize them are already full members of the Polish community; they have jobs and, therefore, their time is limited. Last year, there was only one lecture.

Preserving their culture

But Abdulwahab Bouali brought his religion from his native country. Most of the Polish Muslims, however, have been here for centuries. They can be considered a minority—not an ethnic, but a religious one. Their cultural and religious life is centered in Białystok and the surrounding region, as well as in Gdańsk. A small group of about 5000 people, they have maintained their cultural identity both under Communism and today. The Communist authorities hindered their activity by not allowing them to associate in a civil organization. Before 1989, the only Tartar organization was the Muslim Religious Association.

In 1992, they formed the Association of Polish Tartars, which is headed now by two scholars: Dr Ali Miśkiewicz from the University of Białystok and Dr Selim Chazbijewicz, a poet and publicist based in Gdańsk (who also works in the University of Warmia and Mazury in Olsztyn, northern Poland). The association's main goals are popularizing knowledge about Polish Tartars using publications and the mass media and also preventing young people from leaving Tartar communities. The Polish Tartars' Association has 120 members now, but is planning to cooperate with Belarussian and Lithuanian Tartars, as well as with members of other religious minorities.

Since the early 1990s, there has been a tendency to underline the Tartar features of Polish Islam. There are other Muslim associations in Poland that are not connected to Tartars, such as the Shi'ite Association of Muslim Brothers, based in Pruszków, and the Association of Muslim Unity (also Shi'ite) and the Ahmadijja Muslim Association, both of which are from Warsaw.

But it is the Tartars who seem to be the most active culturally and in terms of presenting Islam to the Poles (or rather, to Christians, as Tartars have Polish citizenship and are as Polish as anyone else between Białystok and Kraków). The most prominent cultural event of the Polish Tartars is "Orienty Sokółskie," a 20-year-old tradition organized in Sokółka, near Białystok, under the auspices of the local culture center. The event's main features are lectures on Muslims' history in Poland and the problems they face today.

Facing the difficulties ahead

These problems may seem minor, but as such a small community there is always the threat of losing cultural and religious identity. Keeping their faith alive requires educated clergy, and this is what Muslims lack. There is only a handful of people who can conduct religious rituals, and they are aged. In order to educate clergy for the Muslim communities in Central and Eastern Europe, a Koran school is being built in Białystok. The progress is slow, because construction began without state or local government subsidies, and funds are running low. Another problem is the mosque in Bohoniki. Since it dates back to the mid-19th century and is considered a historical monument, any renovation for pilgrims requires consent from the local authorities.

Wider access to the mass media would certainly augment Poles' knowledge about this little-known community, but getting to the media seems to be more difficult than building a mosque. The Polish state did not hear pleas for greater funding for celebrations of the 600th anniversary of the Tartars' settlement in Poland (possibly because most Poles associate the arrival of the Tartars with their preceding scorched-earth invasions). Selim Chazbijewicz's idea of guaranteeing Tartars one seat in the Sejm seems totally unrealistic in this context.

"Islam is alien to Poles," says Abdulwahab Bouali. "People are still baffled when they see a Muslim woman on the bus. But a few more years and it will be like in France or Germany; normal, that is." Less misunderstanding and more respect is what Polish Muslims need—whether they have been here for centuries or just years.

Wojtek Kość, 22 January 2001

bron: http://www.ce-review.org/01/3/kosc3.html

PollyCorrect · 25 april 2006, 11:39

En hier nog wat informatie over de moslim gemeenschap in Polen.

http://www.planetaislam.com/poland/report.html

FISHERMAN · 25 april 2006, 11:40

Citaat:

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door PollyCorrect

En hier nog wat informatie over de moslim gemeenschap in Polen.

http://www.planetaislam.com/poland/report.html

Dat zijn dus Tartaren met Aziatische roots en GÉÉN Noord-Afrikanen.

PollyCorrect · 25 april 2006, 11:41

Ja, vandaar dat ze zo'n donker uiterlijk hebben, in tegenstelling met de meeste Polen - MISSCHIEN.

IK ZEG: MISSCHIEN.

Desiderius · 25 april 2006, 11:41

Citaat:

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door FISHERMAN

Volgens de statistieken zijn er bijna evenveel criminele Oost-Europeanen(oa Polen) als criminele Marokanen.

Volgens welke statistieken?

Boadicea · 25 april 2006, 11:43

Citaat:

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door FISHERMAN

Volgens de statistieken zijn er bijna evenveel criminele Oost-Europeanen(oa Polen) als criminele Marokanen.

Oost-Europeanen: dat omvat niet alleen Polen. De Georgische en Albanese maffia worden hier ook in omvat. Oké, diefstal en heling van vooral auto' s kunnen hier ook bijzitten, maar mp3 spelers lijkt me nieuw.

Marokanen: grappig dat het juist door deze groep is dat ik met een mes op keel overvallen ben geweest en dat het ook van dat gespuis is, dat hier op nog geen 2 maanden tijd, drie keer heeft ingebroken.

Sorry, maar de Marokkaanse misdrijven zijn in mijn ogen toch gevaarlijker voor de samenleving dan de Oost-Europese.

Boadicea · 25 april 2006, 11:45

[quote=PollyCorrect;1676223]En hier nog wat informatie over de moslim gemeenschap in Polen.

http://www.planetaislam.com/poland/report.html[/quote]

Dit kan veel verklaren.

vlijmscherp · 25 april 2006, 11:46

Citaat:

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Boadicea

Oost-Europeanen: dat omvat niet alleen Polen. De Georgische en Albanese maffia worden hier ook in omvat. Oké, diefstal en heling van vooral auto' s kunnen hier ook bijzitten, maar mp3 spelers lijkt me nieuw.

Marokanen: grappig dat het juist door deze groep is dat ik met een mes op keel overvallen ben geweest en dat het ook van dat gespuis is, dat hier op nog geen 2 maanden tijd, drie keer heeft ingebroken.

Sorry, maar de Marokkaanse misdrijven zijn in mijn ogen toch gevaarlijker voor de samenleving dan de Oost-Europese.

dus maffia is beter dan geïsoleerde gevallen??
de Albanese maffia zou nochtans al verantwoordelijk zijn voor meerdere moorden in dit land, maar ach, het zijn geen moslims, dus het mag?

baarle · 25 april 2006, 11:48

Citaat:

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door FISHERMAN

De overheid moet alles in het werk stellen om de daders te vinden en deze streng straffen, ongeacht of het nu om Vlamingen, Chinezen, Marokanen, Polen of voor mijn part Marsmannetjes gaat.

Nu neem je mijn stelling over?

FISHERMAN · 25 april 2006, 11:49

Citaat:

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door vlijmscherp

dus maffia is beter dan geïsoleerde gevallen??
de Albanese maffia zou nochtans al verantwoordelijk zijn voor meerdere moorden in dit land, maar ach, het zijn geen moslims, dus het mag?

euh Albanezen zijn nogal vaak Moslim.
Maar de Oost-Europese maffia komt uit quasi het hele Oostblok(Wit-Rusland/Rusland/Oekranie/Polen/Servie-en is dus inderdaad grotendeel Christelijk)

FISHERMAN · 25 april 2006, 11:49

Citaat:

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door baarle

Nu neem je mijn stelling over?

Neen dat is mijn stelling. Misschien hadden we in deze stelling.

baarle · 25 april 2006, 11:50

Citaat:

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door FISHERMAN

Dat zijn dus Tartaren met Aziatische roots en GÉÉN Noord-Afrikanen.

Maakt het nu plots wel iets uit wat de afkomst van de daders is, F.?

Desiderius · 25 april 2006, 11:52

Citaat:

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door FISHERMAN

euh Albanezen zijn nogal vaak Moslim.
Maar de Oost-Europese maffia komt uit quasi het hele Oostblok(Wit-Rusland/Rusland/Oekranie/Polen/Servie-en is dus inderdaad grotendeel Christelijk)

Bullshit!

De Oost-Europese Mafia wordt vooral geleid (en grotendeels bemand) door voormalige apparatchiks van de communistische regimes. (staatspolities, veiligheidsdiensten, hoge ambtenaren etc...) Die gasten zijn gezworen atheïsten; hun portemonnee is hun enige godsdienst. Dus stop nu maar met het koppelen van misdaad aan godsdienstige affiliaties.

FISHERMAN · 25 april 2006, 11:52

Citaat:

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door baarle

Maakt het nu plots wel iets uit wat de afkomst van de daders is, F.?

Wie is er begonnen met "nieuwe Polen" "islamitsche Polen"...
ikke nie

Boadicea · 25 april 2006, 11:53

Citaat:

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door vlijmscherp

dus maffia is beter dan geïsoleerde gevallen??
de Albanese maffia zou nochtans al verantwoordelijk zijn voor meerdere moorden in dit land, maar ach, het zijn geen moslims, dus het mag?

Nee, absoluut NEE.

Maar dit is een gesloten misdaadcircuit en maakt vooral slachtoffers in eigen rangen. Buitenstaanders zullen er minder snel door vermoord worden.

Roofmoordenaars kunnen iedereen treffen.

BitterSweet · 25 april 2006, 11:55

Citaat:

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door ericferemans

Stigmatiseren is dus weeral stupied gebleken...
Gek is dat iedereen er een "allochtoon", een "makkak" enz... in ging zien.
Dit pleit voor de collectief geslaagde stigmatisatie door het VB.

Het uitdelen van middelen tegen paranoia is nu één oplossing.
Het opsluiten van de daders (De leiding van het Vb) is een tweede.
De daders van de paranoia verspreiding bedoel ik, voor de dwazen.

Meisje (15) afgeperst door allochtone jongeren

Een 15-jarig meisje uit Zele, dat elke dag de trein neemt naar school in Dendermonde, is meermaals het slachtoffer geworden van steaming. Dat maakte het parket van Dendermonde vandaag bekend.

Vijf allochtone jongeren dwongen haar geld af te geven. Het meisje werd vier keer lastig gevallen. Twee keer gaf ze geld af aan haar belagers: 60 en 100 euro. De vijf minderjarige daders uit Zele konden gevat worden. Zij worden ter beschikking gesteld van de jeugdrechter, aldus het parket.
Bron HLN.
Dus we laten zo'n zaken maar gebeuren,trouwens vind u dit ook dwaas??

FISHERMAN · 25 april 2006, 11:55

Citaat:

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Desiderius

Bullshit!

De Oost-Europese Mafia wordt vooral geleid (en grotendeels bemand) door voormalige apparatchiks van de communistische regimes. (staatspolities, veiligheidsdiensten, hoge ambtenaren etc...) Die gasten zijn gezworen atheïsten; hun portemonnee is hun enige godsdienst.

Het zijn dus in elk geval geen moslims.

Citaat:

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Desiderius

Dus stop nu maar met het koppelen van misdaad aan godsdienstige affiliaties.

ik ben er niet mee begonnen

vlijmscherp · 25 april 2006, 11:55

Citaat:

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Boadicea

Nee, absoluut NEE.

Maar dit is een gesloten misdaadcircuit en maakt vooral slachtoffers in eigen rangen. Buitenstaanders zullen er minder snel door vermoord worden.

Roofmoordenaars kunnen iedereen treffen.

dus de maffia zijn in feite nog redelijk goed??
ook in de maffia zijn er roofmoordenaars! nog slechter, georganiseerde!

PollyCorrect · 25 april 2006, 11:55

Laten we gewoon rekening houden met bepaalde statistieken.

Ziehier van de site www.planetaislam.com

over de islam in Polen:

2. Present status of the Muslim community.
Today the approximate statistics of the Muslim population in Poland are as follows:

Tatars - 5.000

Foreign Muslims - 25.000

New Polish Muslims - between 500 and 1.000. There are currently no statistics available concerning this group.

25 april 2006, 11:45	#128
Boadicea Perm. Vertegenwoordiger VN Geregistreerd: 29 maart 2006 Locatie: Antwerpen Berichten: 10.422	[quote=PollyCorrect;1676223]En hier nog wat informatie over de moslim gemeenschap in Polen. http://www.planetaislam.com/poland/report.html[/quote] Dit kan veel verklaren. __________________ Opgepast voor geiteneukende honden: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZLyyrLC3cQc

25 april 2006, 11:37	#122
PollyCorrect Perm. Vertegenwoordiger VN Geregistreerd: 11 april 2004 Berichten: 11.718	Hoezo katholiek? Je onderschat de islam in Polen nogal. Waarom zo'n vooroordeel? Tartar Source After six centuries, Poland's Muslims are still misunderstood Wojtek Kość The village's only street, tightly flanked by two rows of low wooden houses, leads past an insignificant green building, also made of wood. Walking through a pleasant yard, one has to negotiate a path between old cherry trees that lead up to the entrance door, where visitors often catche a glimpse of a crescent shape atop the building before knocking. A jovial keeper opens the door and gestures visitors inside. There are Koran verses on the walls. The keeper points out a window which faces distant Mecca: "You may even see it, if you look hard enough," he laughs. Welcome to Bohoniki in eastern Poland. Bohoniki, and nearby Kruszyniany, are most often mentioned because of their mosques, quite an unlikely feature of a village in Poland. An unknown minority Bohoniki and Kruszyniany have been Tartar villages since the 17th century, when King Jan Sobieski III allowed Tartars to settle there as a reward for their loyal service. Descendants of those people still live there, which is evident in the Asian features of the Bohoniki keeper. However, he says, "Our original Tartar blood gets thinner and thinner." Yet the village mosques are still in operation, as Polish Muslims are not confined to these two villages, and they do not necessarily have to be Tartars, even though Tartars constitute the majority of Polish Muslims. They are organized in six religious communities: Warsaw, Białystok, Bohoniki, Kruszyniany, Gdańsk, and Gorzów Wielkopolski. They have three mosques: an 18th century one in Kruszyniany, a mid-19th century one in Bohoniki and a new mosque built in Gdańsk in 1990. There are also prayer houses in Warsaw and Białystok. "It's very difficult to estimate the number of Muslims in Poland, because no census has been conducted thus far. A few years ago, the Polish Muslim Association intended to do it, but the questionnaire they came up with looked more like a police dossier than a declaration of religious creed," says Marek Szymanowicz, a Muslim from Kraków. Misperception and misunderstanding Abdulwahab Bouali, 31, takes care of the Białystok prayer house. He is a member of the Muslim Students Association in Poland, a union of followers of Islam from Muslim countries in the East who have come to Poland to study. Born in Algeria, he has lived in Poland for 14 years now and is a pilot who graduated of the Dęblin Aviation School. "The prayer house I'm taking care of—and live in—will only serve its purpose until the mosque is built here in Białystok," he says. "What we're doing here is ensuring local Muslims get a chance to practice their faith. We also organize lectures for people of other creeds, because the picture of Islam they get from TV is distorted. It is associated with terrorism and a lack of rights for women, but the truth is that Islam is the only creed that does assure women true rights." The lectures, however, have been scarce, because the people that would potentially organize them are already full members of the Polish community; they have jobs and, therefore, their time is limited. Last year, there was only one lecture. Preserving their culture But Abdulwahab Bouali brought his religion from his native country. Most of the Polish Muslims, however, have been here for centuries. They can be considered a minority—not an ethnic, but a religious one. Their cultural and religious life is centered in Białystok and the surrounding region, as well as in Gdańsk. A small group of about 5000 people, they have maintained their cultural identity both under Communism and today. The Communist authorities hindered their activity by not allowing them to associate in a civil organization. Before 1989, the only Tartar organization was the Muslim Religious Association. In 1992, they formed the Association of Polish Tartars, which is headed now by two scholars: Dr Ali Miśkiewicz from the University of Białystok and Dr Selim Chazbijewicz, a poet and publicist based in Gdańsk (who also works in the University of Warmia and Mazury in Olsztyn, northern Poland). The association's main goals are popularizing knowledge about Polish Tartars using publications and the mass media and also preventing young people from leaving Tartar communities. The Polish Tartars' Association has 120 members now, but is planning to cooperate with Belarussian and Lithuanian Tartars, as well as with members of other religious minorities. Since the early 1990s, there has been a tendency to underline the Tartar features of Polish Islam. There are other Muslim associations in Poland that are not connected to Tartars, such as the Shi'ite Association of Muslim Brothers, based in Pruszków, and the Association of Muslim Unity (also Shi'ite) and the Ahmadijja Muslim Association, both of which are from Warsaw. But it is the Tartars who seem to be the most active culturally and in terms of presenting Islam to the Poles (or rather, to Christians, as Tartars have Polish citizenship and are as Polish as anyone else between Białystok and Kraków). The most prominent cultural event of the Polish Tartars is "Orienty Sokółskie," a 20-year-old tradition organized in Sokółka, near Białystok, under the auspices of the local culture center. The event's main features are lectures on Muslims' history in Poland and the problems they face today. Facing the difficulties ahead These problems may seem minor, but as such a small community there is always the threat of losing cultural and religious identity. Keeping their faith alive requires educated clergy, and this is what Muslims lack. There is only a handful of people who can conduct religious rituals, and they are aged. In order to educate clergy for the Muslim communities in Central and Eastern Europe, a Koran school is being built in Białystok. The progress is slow, because construction began without state or local government subsidies, and funds are running low. Another problem is the mosque in Bohoniki. Since it dates back to the mid-19th century and is considered a historical monument, any renovation for pilgrims requires consent from the local authorities. Wider access to the mass media would certainly augment Poles' knowledge about this little-known community, but getting to the media seems to be more difficult than building a mosque. The Polish state did not hear pleas for greater funding for celebrations of the 600th anniversary of the Tartars' settlement in Poland (possibly because most Poles associate the arrival of the Tartars with their preceding scorched-earth invasions). Selim Chazbijewicz's idea of guaranteeing Tartars one seat in the Sejm seems totally unrealistic in this context. "Islam is alien to Poles," says Abdulwahab Bouali. "People are still baffled when they see a Muslim woman on the bus. But a few more years and it will be like in France or Germany; normal, that is." Less misunderstanding and more respect is what Polish Muslims need—whether they have been here for centuries or just years. Wojtek Kość, 22 January 2001 bron: http://www.ce-review.org/01/3/kosc3.html

25 april 2006, 11:39	#123
PollyCorrect Perm. Vertegenwoordiger VN Geregistreerd: 11 april 2004 Berichten: 11.718	En hier nog wat informatie over de moslim gemeenschap in Polen. http://www.planetaislam.com/poland/report.html

25 april 2006, 11:41	#125
PollyCorrect Perm. Vertegenwoordiger VN Geregistreerd: 11 april 2004 Berichten: 11.718	Ja, vandaar dat ze zo'n donker uiterlijk hebben, in tegenstelling met de meeste Polen - MISSCHIEN. IK ZEG: MISSCHIEN.

25 april 2006, 11:55	#140
PollyCorrect Perm. Vertegenwoordiger VN Geregistreerd: 11 april 2004 Berichten: 11.718	Laten we gewoon rekening houden met bepaalde statistieken. Ziehier van de site www.planetaislam.com over de islam in Polen: 2. Present status of the Muslim community. Today the approximate statistics of the Muslim population in Poland are as follows: Tatars - 5.000 Foreign Muslims - 25.000 New Polish Muslims - between 500 and 1.000. There are currently no statistics available concerning this group.