Het duurt 5 min. voor Iran om de Am. vloot in de Perzische Golf tot zinken te brengen

[Johnny Blaze]

ff advocaat van de duivel spelen hier maar ik zie een hoop mensen die, ofwel mijn link niet gelezen hebben, ofwel al vergeten zijn wat er stond. In elk geval, niet zo lang geleden is er dus een Chinese sub gesurfaced midden in (allé, 5 zeemijl is er midden in met huidige wapens) een Amerikaanse vloot die oorlogsoefeningen bezig waren. Als dit 1 keer kan, dan kan dit ook nog een 2de keer. Stof tot nadenken.

[k9]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Johnny Blaze

ff advocaat van de duivel spelen hier maar ik zie een hoop mensen die, ofwel mijn link niet gelezen hebben, ofwel al vergeten zijn wat er stond. In elk geval, niet zo lang geleden is er dus een Chinese sub gesurfaced midden in (allé, 5 zeemijl is er midden in met huidige wapens) een Amerikaanse vloot die oorlogsoefeningen bezig waren. Als dit 1 keer kan, dan kan dit ook nog een 2de keer. Stof tot nadenken.

De titel al eens gelezen? Staat toch echt iran en niet china .

[Johnny Blaze]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door k9

De titel al eens gelezen? Staat toch echt iran en niet china .

Ik weet maar Iran heeft ook duikboten. Ik weet wel niet wa type of zo maar waarom zouden zij dat ook niet kunnen?

Edit: skval torpedo's hebben ze in elk geval wel. Die dingen hebben een theoretische top tot bijna 500 kph en kunnen onderweg bijgestuurd worden.

[D'ARTOIS]

Iran heeft 3 x Kilo klasse sub. Vooral de laatste generatie is bijzonder stil. Het is een populaire sub met veel mogelijkheden. Niet nucleair (Diesel-electric) en eenvoudig in onderhoud voorzoveel je van 'eenvoudig' kan spreken.
De sub vraagt een geringe equipage in vergelijking tot de mastodonten van de VS en Rusland.

[k9]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Johnny Blaze

Ik weet maar Iran heeft ook duikboten. Ik weet wel niet wa type of zo maar waarom zouden zij dat ook niet kunnen?

Goede vraag,

Wel de song klasse is een 2000+ton duikboot, het enige vergelijkbare is de kilo klasse die sterk verouderd is. (30 jaar oud)

De rest van de iraanse vloot zijn mini duikboten die gebruikt worden in ondiepe kust watereren . geen dreiging dus voor een carrier enkele honderden km's in zee.

Edit: skval torpedo's hebben ze in elk geval wel. Die dingen hebben een theoretische top tot bijna 500 kph en kunnen onderweg bijgestuurd worden.

Probeer iets boven 300 km/h en afhankelijk van welke versie iran kopieerde een bereik van 2 tot een 7km wat verschrikkelijk dicht is normale torpedoes hebben bereik van 20-50km .

[k9]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door D'ARTOIS

Iran heeft 3 x Kilo klasse sub. Vooral de laatste generatie is bijzonder stil. Het is een populaire sub met veel mogelijkheden. Niet nucleair (Diesel-electric) en eenvoudig in onderhoud voorzoveel je van 'eenvoudig' kan spreken.
De sub vraagt een geringe equipage in vergelijking tot de mastodonten van de VS en Rusland.

Verouderde versie (die men wel probeert te moderniseren)

En je beseft toch dat de kilo klasse russisch is?

Dat de russen tegenwoordig al 2 generaties verder zitten?

[julian]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Johnny Blaze

ff advocaat van de duivel spelen hier maar ik zie een hoop mensen die, ofwel mijn link niet gelezen hebben, ofwel al vergeten zijn wat er stond. In elk geval, niet zo lang geleden is er dus een Chinese sub gesurfaced midden in (allé, 5 zeemijl is er midden in met huidige wapens) een Amerikaanse vloot die oorlogsoefeningen bezig waren. Als dit 1 keer kan, dan kan dit ook nog een 2de keer. Stof tot nadenken.

Wil niet zeggen dat die niet gedetecteerd was.

[Johnny Blaze]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door julian

Wil niet zeggen dat die niet gedetecteerd was.

Heb ik niet kunnen opmaken uit de info. Had uiteraard gekund, maar ja, als mijn tante een snor had...

[Micele]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Johnny Blaze

Heb ik niet kunnen opmaken uit de info. Had uiteraard gekund, maar ja, als mijn tante een snor had...

idd, deze missile van Hezbollah was alleszins niet gedetecteerd (ze zeggen dat hun msl-afweer niet aan stond ) , en ik die dacht dat Israel Hezbollah niet onderschat...

http://bayourenaissanceman.blogspot....ion-in-us.html
The Israeli Sa'ar 5 class corvette INS Hanit, shown below, was struck by a Chinese C-802 missile, fired by the terrorist movement Hezbollah, off the Lebanese coast in 2006. The impact and explosion fractured the hull from keel to superstructure, and the resulting fire destroyed much of the ship's electrical network. She was forced to curtail operations and return to port for repairs.

http://www.haaretz.com/news/idf-gene...-lead-1.208834

The following were mentioned among the lessons of the war: over-reliance on the Israel Air Force as a counter to Hezbollah; late call-up of reservist divisions; inability to solve the threat posed by short-range rockets; poor training and equipping of ground forces, particularly of reservist units; and failures in how decision making was made at the General Staff level.

Sources at the conference told Haaretz that in taking lessons from the war, Halutz is focusing on ways to prepare the IDF for future confrontations. They also stressed that the gathering was not presented as a setting for disagreements, and therefore many of those in attendance chose not to challenge the investigators' findings and the relatively minor measures taken against individual officers.

Halutz censures 2 colonels over wartime Hezbollah attack on ship

Halutz on Monday decided to censure two senior navy colonels for their conduct during the recent war in Lebanon, after an Iranian-made missile struck a navy boat and cost the lives of four soldiers.

Three additional officers from the ship's crew were also censured.

The attack on the INS Hanit occured the night of July 14, when the ship was cruising off the coast of Beirut. A C-802 surface-to-sea missile struck the ship while it was nearly defenseless - because its missile defense systems had not been activated.

The missile struck a crane on the back of the ship. Had it hit a more sensitive part of the vessel, it could have sunk the ship and its crew of more than 80 officers and sailors.

The IDF-appointed inquiry committee, led by senior naval officer Brigadier General (res.) Nir Maor, concluded that the navy failed in not preparing for the case of Hezbollah using Iranian-made missiles against Israeli ships.

The naval command regarded such a scenario as "imaginary and exaggerated," even though it had been twice warned about this possibility. Three years ago, a Military Intelligence officer raised the possibility of such a scenario, and on the morning of July 14, a naval intelligence officer repeated the warning.

In addition, the investigation revealed serious misconduct in the handling of the ship during combat operations.

Based on the IDF probe's findings, Halutz placed overall responsibility for the incident on the naval command, headed by Major General Dudu Ben-Basat. However, he opted not to take any disciplinary steps against the commander of the navy.

Nonetheless, Halutz reprimanded two officers: the head of naval intelligence and the commander of the missile boats. The ship's captain was also reprimanded, and was informed his next posting would be in a staff position. The officers in charge of the engine room and the electronic warfare systems on the ship were also reprimanded.

Two other officers penalized for unauthorized comments to media

Two other naval officers were penalized in the wake of the attack, Halutz announced on Monday, for making unauthorized comments to the media regarding the incident.

The General Staff defense information department has evidence that a colonel in the Navy spoke to the media, but had not been able to prove that the officer disclosed classified information.

The officer stood trial before Major General Moshe Kaplinsky and was convicted. Kaplinsky, who was convinced that no classified information had been revealed, suggested sending the officer off with a warning. Halutz is expected to issue his own ruling on the matter.

In addition, a lieutenent colonel from the Navy was suspended for 30 days. Over the course of his suspension, his lawyer and the military prosecution will hold a hearing to determine what steps will be taken against the officer.

This is the first time an officer has been suspended over conduct during the war in Lebanon.

Attack on July 14, 2006

During the 2006 Lebanon War, the vessel was patrolling in Lebanese waters ten nautical miles off the coast of Beirut. It was damaged on July 14, 2006 on the waterline, under the aft superstructure [1][2] by a missile (likely a Chinese-designed C-802[3]) fired by Hezbollah. Reportedly, setting the flight deck on fire and crippling the propulsion systems inside the hull.[4] However, INS Hanit stayed afloat, got itself out of the line of fire, and made the rest of the journey back to Ashdod port for repairs on its own.[5] Four crew members were killed during the attack: Staff Sergeant Tal Amgar, Corporal Shai Atas, Sergeant Yaniv Hershkovitz, and First Sergeant Dov Steinshuss.[6]

According to the Israeli Navy, the ship's sophisticated automatic missile defense system was not deployed, even though the early warning system is usually deployed during peace-time wargames. Israel said the defense system was not deployed because of Israeli aircraft in the area.

In the aftermath of the event, reports suggested that no known intelligence existed which would have pointed to the fact that such a sophisticated missile was deployed in Lebanon by Hezbollah. In fact, the investigative work of Ha'aretz journalists Amos Harel and Avi Issacharoff showed that a certain Colonel K., an intelligence officer, had given a lecture already on April 21, 2003, predicting that Hezbollah had shore-to-sea missiles in its possession. Furthermore, on the morning of Friday, July 14, 2006, one of the branch heads of naval intelligence, Lieutenant-Colonel Y. briefed the head of naval intelligence, Colonel Ram Rothberg, telling him that "ships enforcing Israel's naval blockade on Hezbollah should take into account the possibility of a C-802 missile being fired on them." The assessment, however, did not result in a warning. If such a warning had been issued, Israeli ships would have moved further away from the shore and activated their anti-missile systems.[7] waarom zouden ze die dingen niet aanzetten, stroom sparen ofzo ?

As a result of the incident, two navy officers, two junior officers and the commander of the ship have been formally reprimanded and repositioned to non-commanding positions on land. One of the junior officers had shut down the central radar and parts of the defence system without notifying the commander, in the belief that the ship was not under threat.[8] Aha, de zondebok en excuus is gevonden (..)

Repairs occurred over many months and the ship was said to be "recently put back into operation" according to a late 2007 report.[9]

[edit] IDF reportAn IDF report on the Lebanon war incident reveals that the crew did not act sufficiently in order to anticipate the threat.

The IDF report, which was submitted to Chief of Staff Dan Halutz, said, "as far as the intelligence picture is concerned, it was found that despite the lack of pinpoint information about the weapon in the hands of Hezbollah, there was information in the Navy in the past that could have led to some type of an assessment that the enemy holds shore-to-ship missiles." In addition, failures were uncovered in "the way the forces understood the operative reality and implemented it." [10]

The Israeli military has alleged that Iranian military advisors from the Islamic Revolutionary Guards Corps (IRGC) had assisted with deploying and readying the missile launcher.[11]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/INS_Hanit

Met Wikipedia is het soms echt lachen geblazen, Iranische militaire adviseurs... .

Eentje -zelf door een Iraaks vliegtuig - onschadelijk gemaakt

http://bayourenaissanceman.blogspot....ion-in-us.html

The Oliver Hazard Perry class frigate USS Stark, shown below, was hit by two Exocet missiles, fired from an Iraqi warplane, in 1987. Only one exploded, but the damage crippled the ship, rendering her combat-ineffective, and took over a year to repair.
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_kIWY2DV0Kn...Exocet+hit.jpg

1987: eerste Golfoorlog Irak-Iran

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Stark_incident
The USS Stark incident occurred during the Iran–Iraq War on May 17, 1987, when an Iraqi jet aircraft fired missiles at the American frigate USS Stark. Thirty-seven United States Navy personnel were killed and twenty-one others were wounded. The Iraqi government later apologized for the attack.
...
Saddam Hussein apologized for the "unintentional accident", and said that the pilot mistook the USS Stark for an Iranian tanker. American officials claimed that the Iraqi jet's pilot was not acting under orders from his government and that he was later executed. This has been disputed, as an Iraqi Air Force officer later stated that the pilot was not punished and that he was still alive.[citation needed]

Saddam of Irak kon toen eigenlijk ´niets´ verkeerds doen ...

[Micele]

vervolg ´incident USS Stark´, ook geen gelukte detectie ttz onderschepping van 2 air-groundmissiles... tja niet mee gerekend zeker of gewoon naief, ondanks een trackradar-lock ... en dat van Irak met een Mirage en dito missiles..

Iraqis attacked with a French built Dassault Mirage F1 armed with 1,500 pound Exocet missiles. It took off from the airbase of Shaibah at 20:00 and headed south into the Persian Gulf also along the coast. The aircraft was flying 5,000 feet above the water at 550 miles per hour. An AWACS plane on patrol nearby, with an American and Saudi Arabian crew, first detected the incoming Iraqi jet and informed the Stark which picked up the aircraft on radar, 200 miles out. When it came within view just before 10:00 pm, it was off the Stark's port side beam.

Captain Brindel was not alarmed and he ordered his radioman to send a message at 10:09, "Unknown aircraft, this is U.S. Navy warship on your 078 for twelve miles. Request you identify yourself." When the message was not responded to, a second was sent but still there was no reply. At 10:10 Captain Brindel was informed that the Iraqi aircraft had locked his Cyrano-IV fire-control radar onto the ship, then the F-1 fired a missile from twenty-two miles away and a second at fifteen miles. Suddenly the jet banked left and began to withdraw. Stark's STIR system failed to detect the incoming missiles and it was not until seconds before the first hit that the Americans discovered they were under fire. The first Exocet came in at just over ten feet above the sea and struck the port side hull near the bridge, it failed to detonate but rocket fuel ignited and caused a large fire which spread throughout the post office, the store room and the combat operations center.

The second Exocet struck the port side as well and exploded, leaving a ten by fifteen foot hole in the frigate's side. Electronics for the Stark's Standard missile defense went out and Captain Brindel did not order his men to return fire. The AWACS plane was still in the area and just after witnessing the attack, it radioed a nearby Saudi airbase to send aircraft for an interception but the ground controllers did not have the authority to order a sortie so the Iraqi jet escaped unharmed. Legally the American warship was allowed to attack any hostile aircraft within twenty miles. Twenty-nine men were killed in the explosion and fire, eight sailors died later of wounds and twenty-one others wounded. Two Americans of the thirty-seven were lost at sea.

[k9]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Micele

idd, deze missile van Hezbollah was alleszins niet gedetecteerd (ze zeggen dat hun msl-afweer niet aan stond ) , en ik die dacht dat Israel Hezbollah niet onderschat...

EN ik dacht dat dit topic over iran vs VS ging.

Ach ja je hebt nog steeds geen argumeten zie ik.

[k9]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Johnny Blaze

Heb ik niet kunnen opmaken uit de info. Had uiteraard gekund, maar ja, als mijn tante een snor had...

Maakt weinig uit, tot dat ogenblijk kwamen chinese duikboten amper buiten, onbekend dus . Nu doen ze dat geregeld en kan de VS ze rustig bestuderen .

[alfa16vjtd]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door k9

Maakt weinig uit, tot dat ogenblijk kwamen chinese duikboten amper buiten, onbekend dus . Nu doen ze dat geregeld en kan de VS ze rustig bestuderen .

Idd na dit incident zal het geluid dat de Chinese song klasse onderzeeër maakt al beter gekend zijn.

[Nr.10]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door alfa16vjtd

Idd na dit incident zal het geluid dat de Chinese song klasse onderzeeër maakt al beter gekend zijn.

Type 039 submarine
On October 26, 2006, a Chinese Song class submarine is said to have "popped up" and "surfaced within firing range of its torpedoes and missiles before being detected" within 5 nautical miles (9 km) of the carrier USS Kitty Hawk while she was operating in the Pacific Ocean.

wikipedia

De Chinese duikboot had dat vliegdekschip kunnen kelderen.

[Nr.10]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Micele

China gaat heel zeker Iran helpen, heel zeker militaire steun, en wie weet ook nukes.

A professor from the Chinese National Defense University says if Iran is attacked, China will not hesitate to protect the Islamic Republic even by launching the Third World War. Major General Zhang Zhaozhong said, "China will not hesitate to protect Iran even with a third World War."
bron
_{4 december 2011}

[C2C]

Iran is inderdaad een makkelijke prooi. Haar enige kans van overleven is een vettige grondoorlog, waarbij de Amerikaanse infanterie op Iraans grondgebied wordt gesleurd en hevige verliezen zal leiden.

De publieke opinie keert zich dan tegen de "gruwel" en Iran kan nog een stap verder radicaliseren.

Amerika leidt aan "imperial overstretch" en kan zich zo'n invasie-scenario absoluut niet veroorloven.

Ik geloof eerder in pijnlijke speldenprikjes door Israël en de VS, en pogingen van die twee tot het aanstoken van interne verzetsbewegingen in Iran, zoals we dat overal in het Midden-Oosten zien. Da's veel goedkoper en bijna risicoloos.

[C2C]

En duizenden drones, natuurlijk.

[Creed]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door C2C

En duizenden drones, natuurlijk.

How about we send a couple thousand intellectual belgian dumbasses and tuinkabouterkes?
Now, that will make Ahmajinejad think twice!