VLD'er geeft antisemiet recht van antwoord

[Philips Inc.]

Je antwoordt naast de kwestie.

1. Jodendom = religie; dus in combinatie met nationalisme wordt dit een religieus nationalisme.

2. Het doel van de Hamas is het zelfde als van de zionisten: een religieuze staat.

Jood zijn kan bijna uitsluitend als je als jood geboren bent. Het Joodse volk is dus niet alleen religieus maar ook etnisch nationalisme.

Het beginselprogramma van de politieke, zionistische beweging werd vastgesteld: het streven naar een publiekrechtelijk gewaarborgde woonplaats voor het joodse volk (in de oorspronkelijk Duitse formulering:
"Offentlich-rechtlich gesicherte Heimst„tte".
In dit programma lag de kracht van de moderne zionistische beweging omdat het de joden als volk aan de orde stelde, aansluitend aan de negentiende eeuwse criteria voor een volk, dus niet alleen op religieuze gronden.

[dagallemaal]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door Philips Inc.

Je antwoordt naast de kwestie.

1. Jodendom = religie; dus in combinatie met nationalisme wordt dit een religieus nationalisme.

2. Het doel van de Hamas is het zelfde als van de zionisten: een religieuze staat.

Jood zijn kan bijna uitsluitend als je als jood geboren bent. Het Joodse volk is dus niet alleen religieus maar ook etnisch nationalisme.

Het beginselprogramma van de politieke, zionistische beweging werd vastgesteld: het streven naar een publiekrechtelijk gewaarborgde woonplaats voor het joodse volk (in de oorspronkelijk Duitse formulering:
"Offentlich-rechtlich gesicherte Heimst„tte".
In dit programma lag de kracht van de moderne zionistische beweging omdat het de joden als volk aan de orde stelde, aansluitend aan de negentiende eeuwse criteria voor een volk, dus niet alleen op religieuze gronden.

Jij bent volkomen naast de kwestie met je drie punten. Jij werkt in zwart-wit alleen op bepaalde uitspraken uit hun context genomen en de context is juist belangrijk. Meer ga ik er ook niet meer over schrijven want je hebt een paar ooglapjes op en het is niet langs zo'n forum dat je ze zult afzetten

[bruut geweld]

idd ben eveneens OVERTUIGD anti-zionist en ben ZKER NIET ALLEEN !

volgende tekst van een rabbi; vragen aan de zionisten (en die zal volgens de zionistjes wel gek zijn zker ? dateert uit de relevante jaren waarin al die zever ontstaan is.

Ten questions to the Zionists
by Rabbi Michael Dov Weissmandl ZT"L
Dean of Nitra Yeshiva and author of min hametzar

(Published by the author in 1948 and reprinted many times)
1.
IS IT TRUE that in 1941 and again in 1942, the German Gestapo offered all European Jews transit to Spain, if they would relinquish all their property in Germany and Occupied France; on condition that:
a) none of the deportees travel from Spain to Palestine; and
b) all the deportees be transported from Spain to the USA or British colonies, and there to remain; with entry visas to be arranged by the Jews living there; and
c) $1000.00 ransom for each family to be furnished by the Agency, payable upon the arrival of the family at the Spanish border at the rate of 1000 families daily.

2.
IS IT TRUE that the Zionist leaders in Switzerland and Turkey received this offer with the clear understanding that the exclusion of Palestine as a destination for the deportees was based on an agreement between the Gestapo and the Mufti.

3.
IS IT TRUE that the answer of the Zionist leaders was negative, with the following comments:
a) ONLY Palestine would be considered as a destination for the deportees.
b) The European Jews must accede to suffering and death greater in measure than the other nations, in order that the victorious allies agree to a "Jewish State" at the end of the war.
c) No ransom will be paid

4.
IS IT TRUE that this response to the Gestapo's offer was made with the full knowledge that the alternative to this offer was the gas chamber.

5.
IS IT TRUE that in 1944, at the time of the Hungarian deportations, a similar offer was made, whereby all Hungarian Jewry could be saved.

6.
IS IT TRUE that the same Zionist hierarchy again refused this offer (after the gas chambers had already taken a toll of millions).

7.
IS IT TRUE that during the height of the killings in the war, 270 Members of the British Parliament proposed to evacuate 500,000 Jews from Europe, and resettle them in British colonies, as a part of diplomatic negotiations with Germany.

8.
IS IT TRUE that this offer was rejected by the Zionist leaders with the observation "Only to Palestine!"

9.
IS IT TRUE that the British government granted visas to 300 rabbis and their families to the Colony of Mauritius, with passage for the evacuees through Turkey. The "Jewish Agency" leaders sabotaged this plan with the observation that the plan was disloyal to Palestine, and the 300 rabbis and their families should be gassed.

10.
IS IT TRUE that during the course of the negotiations mentioned above, Chaim Weitzman, the first "Jewish statesman" stated: "The most valuable part of the Jewish nation is already in Palestine, and those Jews living outside Palestine are not too important". Weitzman's cohort, Greenbaum, amplified this statement with the observation "One cow in Palestine is worth more than all the Jews in Europe".

There are additional similar questions to be asked of these atheist degenerates known as "Jewish statesmen", but for the time being let them respond to the ten questions.

These Zionist "statesmen" with their great foresight, sought to bring an end two two-thousand years of Divinely ordained Jewish subservience and political tractability. With their offensive militancy, they fanned the fires of anti-Semitism in Europe, and succeeded in forging a bond of Jew-hatred between Nazi-Germany and the surrounding countries.

These are the "statesmen" who organized the irresponsible boycott against Germany in 1933. This boycott hurt Germany like a fly attacking an elephant - but it brought calamity upon the Jews of Europe. At a time when America and England were at peace with the mad-dog Hitler, the Zionist "statesmen" forsook the only plausible method of political amenability; and with their boycott incensed the leader of Germany to a frenzy. And then, after the bitterest episode in Jewish history, these Zionist "statesmen" lured the broken refugees in the DP camps to remain in hunger and deprivation, and to refuse relocation to any place but Palestine; only for the purpose of building their State.

The Zionist "statesmen" have incited and continue to incite an embittered Jewish youth to futile wars against world powers like England, and against masses of hundreds of millions of Arabs.

AND THESE SAME ZIONIST "STATESMEN" HEEDLESSLY PUSH THE WORLD TO THE BRINK OF ANOTHER TOTAL WAR - REVOLVING ENTIRELY AROUND THE HOLY LAND.

What may befall the Jewish inhabitants of Palestine, of the Arab crescent, Europe, or the USA; is of no concern to these Zionist leaders. The rising anti-Semitism in the Western World is the product of their "statesmanship".

Under the guise of "love of Israel", the Zionist "statesmen" seduced many Jews to replace devotion to the Torah and its Sages with devotion to the scoundrel who founded Zionism. It is of no little significance that Herzl originally sought conversion of the Jews as a solution to the problems of the Diaspora. When he realized that this was not acceptable to the Jewish masses, he contrived Zionism as a satisfactory alternative!

A look into history reveals that this very same type of "statesmen" opposed the call of Jeremiah the prophet to yield to the minions of Nebuchadnezzar at the destruction of the first Temple. Five centuries later, Rabbi Yochonon Ben Zakai appealed to the people to surrender to Titus the Roman to avoid bloodshed. The "statesmen" rejected this appeal, and the second Temple was destroyed by the Romans. --- And now for the past fifty years, the Zionist "statesmen" rebuff the leadership of our Sages; and continue in their policy of fomenting anti-Semitism. When will they stop?? Must every Jew in America also suffer?? - Even the Nazi monsters had more sense, and gave up their war before all Germany was destroyed. The Zionist "statesmen" ridicule the sacred oath which the Creator placed upon the Jews in the Diaspora. Our Torah, in Tractate Ksubos, folio 111, specifies that the Creator, blessed be He, swore the Jews not to occupy the Holy Land by force, even if it appears that they have the force to do so; and not rebel against the Nations. And the Creator warned that if His oath be desecrated, Jewish flesh would be "open property", like the animals in the forest!! These are words of our Torah; and these concepts have been cited in Maimonides' "Igeres Teimon", "Be'er HaGola", "Ahavas Yehonosson", and in "Toras Moshe" of the Chasam Sofer.

IT IS COMMON KNOWLEDGE THAT ALL THE SAGES AND SAINTS IN EUROPE AT THE TIME OF HITLER'S RISE DECLARED THAT HE WAS A MESSENGER OF DIVINE WRATH, SENT TO CHASTEN THE JEWS BECAUSE OF THE BITTER APOSTASY OF ZIONISM AGAINST THE BELIEF IN THE EVENTUAL MESSIANIC REDEMPTION.

Yidden - merciful sons of merciful fathers - how much longer must holy Jewish blood continue to be shed??

The only solution is:

The Jewish people must reject, outright, a "Jewish State".

The Jewish people should accept the US compromise.

We must depose the atheist-Zionist "statesmen" from their role as Jewish leaders, and return to the faithful leadership of our sages.

We beseech the Nations to open all doors to immigration - not only the doors of Palestine.

Peaceful, non-Zionist religious personalities in Palestine, (particularly from the native population) and their counterparts in the Diaspora, should engage in responsible, face-to face negotiations on behalf of the Jewish people, with the British and the Arabs; with an aim of amicable settlement of the Palestine issue.



Every Jew is obliged to pray to the Blessed creator, for in Him lies all our strength. Let us bear in mind that our prayers be forthright. One should not entreat the Creator to provide a banquet on Yom Kippur, and one can not perform a ritual ablution with a dead bug in his hand. Similarly, we should avoid the untenable position of the robber who prays for Divine help in carrying out his crime. We should pray that Zionism and its fruits vanish from the Earth, and that we be redeemed by the Messiah with dispatch.

A prisoner is released only when he has served his time, or if he is pardoned by the President for good behavior. If he attempts escape and is apprehended, his term is lengthened, besides the beating he receives when he is caught.

Faithful Jews- for over three and one-half thousand years, in all parts of the world, through all trials, our grandfathers and grandmothers marched through seas of blood and tears in order to keep the Faith of the Torah unswervingly. If we have compassion for ourselves, for our women and children, and for the Jewish people, we will maintain our golden legacy today. We have been sentenced to exile by the King of Kings because of our sins. The eternal blessed be He, has decreed that we accept the exile with humble gratitude until the time comes, or until we merit His pardon through repentance if we seek to end the exile with force, G-d will catch us, as our sages have forewarned, and our sentence becomes longer and more difficult.

Many times in the past have segments of our people been defrauded by false messiahs - but none of the false messiahs has been as fallacious and delusory as the lie of Zionism. With our historical experience as our guide, no retribution has been or will be greater than the retribution for giving credence to Zionism. If we wish our exile-sentence commuted, we must appeal through repentance; and through total physical and spiritual observance of the Sabbath, laws of family purity, and study of Torah.

Let it be clearly understood that never in Jewish history (even in the time of Jeroboam or Achav) have such hostile atheists stood at the helm of he Jewish people as today.

How can we plead to the Almighty for mercy while we tolerate these vile, "wicked" leaders as spokesmen! Beloved brothers - let us cleanse our ranks and cleanse our midst; let us entreat the Almighty through prayer, repentance, and fulfillment of mitzvos that He alone redeem us, immediately.

READ EXCERPT FROM RABBI WEISSMANDL'S BOOK Sefer Min Hametzar

[Philips Inc.]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door dagallemaal

Jij bent volkomen naast de kwestie met je drie punten. Jij werkt in zwart-wit alleen op bepaalde uitspraken uit hun context genomen en de context is juist belangrijk. Meer ga ik er ook niet meer over schrijven want je hebt een paar ooglapjes op en het is niet langs zo'n forum dat je ze zult afzetten

De ooglappen zitten eerder bij u, want in je drie postings heb je nog geen enkel argument gegeven noch ontkracht.

Men noemt dit ook wel zielig.

Ik ben geen anti-jood, ik ben wel een liberaal en dus anti-zionist die scheiding van godsdienst en staat hulde breng.
Net zoals ik de islamitische fundamentalisten van de Moslimbroederschappen en co totaal afkeur.

[dagallemaal]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door bruut geweld

idd ben eveneens OVERTUIGD anti-zionist en ben ZKER NIET ALLEEN !

volgende tekst van een rabbi; vragen aan de zionisten (en die zal volgens de zionistjes wel gek zijn zker ? dateert uit de relevante jaren waarin al die zever ontstaan is.

Overtuigd anti-zionist is zeker een synoniem voor antisemiet wat jou betreft en ik geloof dat je zeker niet alleen bent; zo zijn er nog Abou blahblah, Yassin, Saddam, Hitler, Stalin. "High Society" groepje waar je deel van uitmaakt.
Je gaat gewoon ergens een tekstje van de ene of andere geflipte rabbijn (zoals er ook soms geflipte priesters zijn, maar vooral veel geflipte imams) uit een hoekje halen om je rassenhaat te kunnen justifieren. Natuurlijk "bruut geweld" dat de Joden toen en Israël nu alle onheil van de wereld veroorzaakt; dat heb je toch in Mein Kampf en de protocollen van de wijzen van Zion ook al gelezen.

[bruut geweld]

leuk dat je me impliciet gelijk geeft door op de man te spelen ipv de bal.

knulleke , je hebt namelijk geen argumenten ! en dan rest er je niets anders dat dit pad te bewandelen he...

ik ben geen antisemiet, en gelukkig dat ik persoonlijk in antwerpen wel joden ken, want als jij als het prototype zou moeten doorgaan, zou ik naast overtuigd anti-zionist ook wel anti semiet kunnen worden ..

het is dergelijke arrogantie van jouw soort (en niet ras/religie) die aan de basis lag van het algemeen anti joodse gevoelen in de jaren 30 in gans europa. en dan kregen fanatici hun kans om daar op in te spelen.
bezint eer ge begint

[bruut geweld]

LETTER FROM Rabbi AMRAM BLAU OPPOSING ZIONISM
Jerusalem, January 17, 1974

To All Those Who Believe in Justice:

Nations of the world accepted the clear lie when they recognized the Zionists, those heretics who established their state through conquest under the name of “Israel,” as any part of the Jewish People. The nations thereby enabled the Zionist heretics to conquer the Jewish People themselves. Through this action those nations offended the authentic Jewish People, its Torah and faith in a way much worse than how the Jewish People has ever been injured by the Arabs, in view of the fact that these Zionist heretics and their establishment of their state through conquest have no connection to the Jewish People.

It is known that only the Torah defines the Jewish People. The Jewish People have no involvement with Zionists, Zionism or their state conceived under the notion of nationalism. Judaism has nothing to do with nationalism.

The Jewish People are absolutely opposed to any injury against the Arab nation. The Arab nation never harmed the Jewish People until the advent of Zionist nationalism. The Jewish People are commanded by the Torah to seek the peace of the governments where they are citizens, and not to rebel against any nation, G-d forbid, especially when this concerns the Holy Land, to which we are forbidden to engage in mass immigration.

Jews who follow the Torah are not even suspected of murder or any injury against any person, and we are severely prohibited from engaging in any violent action, including in relation to the struggle over Palestine. Judaism is totally opposed to nationalism, and in fact Jews have refused to move to the Zionist state even though the state proclaims itself as the representative of the Jewish People.

All Jews who believe in G-d and his Torah, and who observe the Torah and its commandments, are loyal to the oaths sworn to G-d, and have no involvement in this nationalist revolution, but rather are hostages under Zionist conquest. Even those who have been dragged into the Zionist project do so against the teachings of their faith and religion. The Zionists tell everyone who opposes their ideology to leave the country, but they are wrong!

Every person in the world who believes in justice must know that the entire world will not be spared if the Zionist experiment is allowed to continue, because many innocent people will be harmed. Every person who is merciful and just must rise up and put a stop to the Zionists!

May G-d bestow peace on us and the entire world.

I request that my letter be distributed wherever it can have a benefit.

Amram Blau

[bruut geweld]

When the Zionists Killed Yaakov Yisrael Dehan on July 1, 1924
(From the newsletter of Neturei Karta in Jerusalem – Hachoma, Tammuz-July 5762/2002)


The young martyr, Dr. Yaakov Yisrael Dehan was murdered on July 1, 1924. He was a man who devoted all his energies and the best years of his life to saving the remnant of loyal Jews, and to promote peace with the veteran Arab residents of the Holy Land. Through his knowledge of politics and diplomacy, Dehan contributed much to crystallizing an independent position for Orthodox Jewry unaffiliated with the Zionist leadership.

At a time when the first followers of the Zionist movement began streaming into the Holy Land in large numbers, defiling the holiness of the land, and by virtue of their idiotic ideas began to work to expel the Arabs who had been living there for centuries in order to establish a Zionist state.

The Zionists first approached the British authorities by pretending to present themselves as the representatives of the Jewish nation, who desired to establish a “national home” without any regard whatsoever of the fact that the vast majority of the Jewish People opposed Zionism in those days. However, through their various contacts, the Zionists managed to bring about the Balfour Declaration (known among our rabbis of the time as the Baal Peor Declaration – a pun referring to the idolatry mentioned in the Bible), based on the “right” of the Jews to establish a state in Palestine, and ultimately the state itself to our great misfortune.

Good relations existed between the Jewish and Arab communities, and the leadership of the Orthodox Jewish community conducted themselves according to the principles of Judaism, never provoking their non-Jewish neighbors. The Arabs were very friendly and neighborly, and a spirit of mutual respect was typical.

When the winds of Zionism began to blow through Palestine, the Arabs began to change their attitude because of the fact that they heard that the “Jews” wanted to grab the Land from them and expel them. Of course, they did not distinguish between the Zionist troublemakers and the members of the loyal authentic Jewish community that advocated tolerance and peace. There were outbreaks of violence here and there, until bloodshed began and many people died.

However, instead of learning from this experience that brought suffering upon the Jewish People in the Holy Land, and ceasing their dangerous lawless behavior, the Zionists used these events as “additional proof” for the need for a state and an army to protect the Jews from violence. Jewish blood was of no importance to the Zionists in comparison to their “lofty” nationalist goals.

It was clear to the leaders of the Orthodox community that there was an immediate need for an organization to confront the Zionist organization, and demand that the British desist from endorsing the idea of a Zionist state, and resolve Arab-Jewish tensions peacefully.

A great and unexpected opportunity presented itself in the form of Dr. Yaakov Yisrael Dehan, who had embraced Judaism from a life of secularism, and had made his way to the Orthodox community of Jerusalem during those difficult days. He sensed the truth, and from then on never ceased to march with the great rabbi of Jerusalem, Rabbi Yosef Chaim Zonnenfeld, who wisely advised Dehan.

Dehan established extensive contacts with many governmental authorities in Europe, including the English, and proceeded to carry out his work immediately. In no time at all he transformed the loyal Jewish community from a tiny one without any international recognition to a community standing up against the Zionist heretics. He and other members of the community represented the Orthodox Jews under the name of “Eida Haredis” (G-d-Fearing Community), and represented the position of the loyal Jewish community.

It goes without saying that the Eida Haredis was accepted warmly among non-Jews, much moreso than was the case with the Zionists – both because of the fact that the Eida Haredis represented traditional, authentic Judaism against Zionism that openly rejected Judaism in its entirety, and because of the fact that the Orthodox position made more sense in order to prevent bloodshed and promote harmony in Palestine.

Dr. Dehan then organized a delegation of Orthodox leaders to meet with Arab leaders headed by King Abdullah. The Jewish delegation was headed by Rabbi Zonnenfeld, and was welcomed by the Arabs like royalty. The king even gave them expensive gifts as a sign of his affection. Of course the Zionists were gritting their teeth when they learned of this event, and saw the possibility that all of their projects may end up collapsing in front of their very eyes. The Zionists began their attacks against the loyal Jewish community in general, and against Dr. Dehan in particular. They slandered him with increasing brutality until they went so far as to call for his murder.

In those days the G-d-fearing Jews were persecuted greatly by the Zionists, and whenever they ran into Dehan in the street they would insult him. However, Dehan never ceased his holy work on behalf of our rabbis. When the Zionists realized that their persecution of Dehan had no effect, they decided to kill him.

In a plan approved by the leading Haganah Zionists a number of young Zionists encountered Dr. Dehan as he left the Shaarei Zedek Hospital in Jerusalem. The Zionist Avraham Tahomi, may his name be obliterated, shot Dehan three times in the chest, and shortly thereafter Dehan expired, returning his soul to heaven. This murder was carried out with the approval of the Zionist leadership.

On that fateful day of July 1, 1924, when the Zionists committed their crime, for which we suffer to this very day and still do not see the end in sight, they shot him in his pure heart. But they did not only shoot him and kill him, but they shot and killed the entire People, thereby preventing any plan that did not comply with their wicked intentions.

Nevertheless, some seventy-eight years after that horrible day, there is still a community of Jews following in the authentic path, and refusing to bow to the Zionist idol. It is in large measure due to the selfless holy efforts of Yaakov Dehan, a martyr of his people who paved the way with self-sacrifice that there are still Jews who refuse to succumb to the Zionist regime of heretics despite the fact that the Zionists overpower the authentic Jews with their laws and power, It is in the merit of Yaakov Dahan that there are still Jews today throughout the world who stand and announce unflinchingly their unswerving loyalty to the countries in which they live, and that there are still Jews in this world who declare to the nations of world that the Zionists and their state has no link with Judaism or the Jewish People.


The funeral of Professor DeHaan was attended by
thousands of mourners.
His murder proved to every loyal Jew that the Zionists appearing on the scene were no friends of the Jewish People, but were murderers who hated Judaism, something that was the beginning of the opportunity of recognizing the enemy. On the most recent anniversary of Dehan’s murder we remembered the good work of Dr. Yaakov Yisrael Dehan on behalf of authentic Judaism in his war against Zionism and its wicked plans. Let us learn from his work to strengthen our resolve and dedication in refusing to bow to the Zionist idol, and to pray for divine providence to redeem the world.

[dagallemaal]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door bruut geweld

leuk dat je me impliciet gelijk geeft door op de man te spelen ipv de bal.

knulleke , je hebt namelijk geen argumenten ! en dan rest er je niets anders dat dit pad te bewandelen he...

ik ben geen antisemiet, en gelukkig dat ik persoonlijk in antwerpen wel joden ken, want als jij als het prototype zou moeten doorgaan, zou ik naast overtuigd anti-zionist ook wel anti semiet kunnen worden ..

het is dergelijke arrogantie van jouw soort (en niet ras/religie) die aan de basis lag van het algemeen anti joodse gevoelen in de jaren 30 in gans europa. en dan kregen fanatici hun kans om daar op in te spelen.
bezint eer ge begint

het is duidelijk daarom dat ik schreef dat jij antisemiet bent en ik de man speel en niet de bal. De Shoah in de schoenen van de Joden schuiven zoals jij hierboven wilt aangeven is daar een duidelijke bewijs van. Ik was even voorop op je schrijven.

En dat je persoonlijk Joden kent haalt daar niets van af. Herlees Sartre maar eens en zelfs elke Nazi kende wel een "volgens hem goede Jood".

Als je al toegeeft dat het feit dat je in het ongelijk gesteld wordt door een "knulletje" van jou een antisemiet zou maken betekent hat dat die stap toch al zeer klein moet zijn voor jezelf

[bruut geweld]

typische tactiek :

u bent een anti semiet
wij zijn slachtoffers


DIT MAAKT HOEGENAAMD GEEN INDRUK MEER ! dat spelletje hebben de zionisten tientallen jaren kunnen toepassen, maar het is uitgemolken.
en dan spreek ik over de overgrote europese meerderheid die blijkbaar meer en meer anti zionist wordt.
als jij mij en dergelijke mensen in het kamp van rassenhaters/antisemieten wil steken, snij je in je eigen vlees. Ze kunnen het dan wel eens gaan worden...

en de joden zelf verantwoordelijk ? Ja voor het klimaat dat toen heerste .
Uiteraard niet voor de holocaust ! verwees naar fanatici die daardoor hun kans kregen . uw simpele zwart/wit geest kadert me dan maar bij diezelfde fanatici ..
een arrogantie die typisch zionistisch is ?
nog steeds geen argumenten op mijn posts en anderen , enkel het gekende zaagverhaal : wij zijn slachtoffer en dus mogen wij aLLES ...
da pakt niet meer knulleke

[bruut geweld]

ZIENE KEER HOEVEEL "GEFLIPTE" RABBI's


PUBLIC PROTEST
Friday, July 5, 2002


We were astonished to learn that one of the leaders of the Zionist State of Israel was invited to attend a party in our community, and gave a speech there.

This entity, which our rabbis have taught us is in opposition to our Torah, and which uproots our religion under the banner of nationalism, is the source of mischief, and is the root cause of all types of suffering experienced by our brethren in the Holy Land, exactly as predicted by our ancient prophets and by our rabbis.

Therefore, we hereby virulently protest against this treacherous act of honoring a politician of that State that rebels against G-d, to listen to his words and to collaborate with evildoers, thereby breaking down the prohibitions of our rabbis throughout the generations.

(Signatures are according to the Hebrew alphabet)



Avraham Menachem Mendel Wagschal
Rabbi of Kahal Divrei Yechezkel Shinova Synagogue

Elimelech Yechezkel Shraga Gold
Head Rabbinical Judge of Kahal Sha’arei Chesed Synagogue

Chaim Avraham Duber Flohr
Head of Zichron Menachem Rabbinical Academy

Chaim Yehoshua Halberstam
Head Rabbinical Judge and Principal of Satmar Yeshiva

Chaim Yechezkel Shraga Deutsch
Rabbi of Kol Yehoshua-Mekor Chaim Synagogue

Yosef Zalman Bloch
Rabbi of Lakewood Minyan-Synagogue

Menachem Mayer Weissmandel
Head Rabbinical Judge of Toras Chemed, Nitra, Synagogue

Menachem Fischer
Rabbinical Judge and Rabbi of Vien Synagogue, Monsey

Moshe Green
Principal of Yeshiva of Monsey

Nosson Yosef Meisels
Head Rabbinical Judge and Rabbi of Kahal Avnei Shlomo Synagogue

Shlomo Mordechai Breslauer
Head Rabbinical Judge of Beis Tefila Synagogue

Shlomo Avigdor Feivelsohn
Principal of Yeshiva Le-Torah Ve-Le-Tefila

I also sign hereunder to this public protest against those who honored one of the leaders of the State of Israel here in Monsey. May G-d illuminate us with a spirit of purity and enable us to behold the arrival of the Messiah
Yisrael Hager
son of the Rebbe of the Vizhnitz-Monsey community

[bruut geweld]

en de lijst van "geflipte" rabbis en joden gaat maar door en door :

STATEMENT TO THE
U.N. SPECIAL COMMITTEE ON PALESTINE
July 16, 1947
by Chief Rabbi Yosef tzvi Dushinsky
Taken from the United Nations Trusteeship Library

1

The ancient right of the People of Israel to the land of Israel.

In approaching what is commonly called the Palestine problem and in trying to find a just and suitable solution it is imperative that the history of the Holy Land and its correlation with the Jewish people be viewed in their proper perspective.

Indeed from the day onwards on which the L-rd said to Abraham: "Arise, walk through the Land, in the length of it and in the breadth, for I will give it unto thee" (Genesis, 13, 17), this country was predestined to be the land of domicile for the People of Israel. However, this predestination, this divine promise, has its basis but in religion, for only loyalty to HIS laws and teachings and fundamental application of that Law in Israel's public and private life will entitle them to the name "People of Israel" and only then can the term "Land of Israel" apply to this land as it is aid: "And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation" (Exodus 19, 6) and further: "For thou art a holy people under the L-rd, thy G-d." (Deuteronomy 7, 6). The interrelation between the land of Israel and the people of Israel rise and falls with the degree and intensity with which they fulfill the Holy Law. Past experience proves that Israel fell easy prey to their enemies whenever they deviated from the path prescribed in the Holy Bible, a fact to which the chapters of the Bible bear eloquent evidence.

2

Unbroken settlement by Jews throughout the ages.


Hence, even after the dispersion, when Israel were scattered to the four corners of the world to atone for their sins and prepare themselves for the great task of being a holy nation and of being fit once again to live in the land of their promise, Jews loyal to the tradition of their forefathers have not severed the connection with the land even for short intervals. Though unable to fulfill all the commandments while residing abroad, particularly those relating to the soil of this land, they have constantly directed and arranged their prayers with their faces towards the Holy Land in accordance with I King 8, 48: "And pray unto thee towards their land."

Some Jews endeavoured to visit the Holy Land at least once in their lives and at later periods, when transport and traffic connections became easier, these loyal Jews began to return to the Holy Land to live permanently therein in holiness and purity and literally applied the verse (Psalms 102, 14): "For thy servants take pleasure in her stones and favour the dust thereof."

The relation between the people of Israel and the land of Israel being an ancient and permanent religious tie, Providence has seen to it that throughout the long history of this land, Jews were never to abandon it entirely. . . .

3

Good neighbourly relations with other sections of the population.


During no period of the immigration of such orthodox European Jews was any opposition offered by the Arab population. On the contrary, these Jews were welcomed on account of economic benefits and general progress that accrued to the local inhabitants who had no fear whatsoever of being subjugated. It was common knowledge that these Jews came but for the purpose of fulfilling certain religious requirements and they had no difficulty in establishing a mutual trust, and real friendship developed with all sections of the community. That was the time when good neighborly relations existed between Jews and Arabs and in particular Rabbis and eminent scholars who then lead the Jewish Community were greatly esteemed and honoured by all inhabitants.
4

Palestine under the Mandate.

With the occupation of Palestine by His Britannic Majesty's Forces and after the confirmation of the Mandate over Palestine by the League of Nations, which incorporated the Balfour Declaration of 1917 a new era opened in the history of the Holy Land. We Orthodox Jews whose forefathers promoted the development of the Jewish Yishuv throughout the generations, who for many centuries constituted the most important element of the Yishuv in the Holy Land, were always on the very best of terms with all sections of the Community. We had hoped that the real purpose of the Mandate would be the promotion of a "Home" to which Jews who lived in the Diaspora might be able to return as their Home Land in order to live here in accordance with the Commandments of the Almighty. It was upon the first appearance of the Zionist organization as a political entity, created in and by the spirit of reform, a spirit to which Orthodox Jewry is so utterly opposed that the idea of the foundation of a Jewish state in the Holy Land was first advanced.

Much trouble and endless bloodshed might have been avoided if the Mandate were to have been applied in the manner hoped for by Orthodox Jewry.

In addition the various Jewish Communities in the country had been organized along traditional lines of truly Jewish Law, by actively applying the Laws of Moses to the public affairs of the Holy Land, we are convinced that the country would have remained at peace and the dangers inherent in prevailing conditions might never have arisen. Moreover, the colossal massacre of millions of our brethren at the hands of Nazism during the second World War might have been averted to a very substantial degree for many of them might have been able to live peacefully in the Holy Land as there would have been not the slightest justification for the limitations of Jewish immigration as have in fact been enforced during the last decade.

However, it is a regrettable fact that a serious blunder was committed at the time by recognising first the leaders of Zionism and then the Jewish Agency as official representation of the Jewish population and by handing the keys of immigration to that body which consists of zionists and non-zionists who are united in the opposition to the application of religion to public life and they have succeeded in bringing to this country free-thinking people like themselves who blocked the way of immigration to myriads of Orthodox Jews. Only after prolonged and forceful representations supported by the Government of Palestine did they agree to issue small numbers of certificates for immigration also to Orthodox Jews. They have thus succeeded in strengthening their position by bringing in elements of the population who were faithful to their aims and ideals and have founded Jewish Communities throughout the country whose very spirit is contrary to the requirements of Jewish Law and have thereby furthered their hold in the country, by insisting on the creation of a Jewish state therein. This aroused the fear of our Arab neighbors in connection with further Jewish immigration and thus started the determined opposition on the part of the Arabs against Jewish immigration.

5

Palestine as a State.

From the time of King Solomon to our very days the Holy Land was either united with Trans-Jordan or attached to Syria or Turkey. Western Palestine was never a single and independent entity and certainly a part of that cannot possibly constitute an independent state, as envisaged in the various plans that are discussed from time to time.

However, the basic reason for our opposition to an Independent Jewish state as that in prevailing circumstances the officially recognised representation of the Jewish people does not consider the authority of the Holy Law as binding in the public affairs of the Jewish people. . . .

. . . .and it is contrary to the wishes of G-d to create a Jewish State. . .

6

Summary of Part I

Orthodox Jewry has not the slightest intention of subjugating any section of the population of the Holy Land. We merely demand that the gates of Palestine be opened to all those Jews who have no home and enable them to live here Jewish lives in accordance with the commandments of the L-rd. However in order to avoid the continuation of the untenable position as set out in the last paragraph of section 4 we suggest that the keys of Jewish immigration be placed into the hands of the Government of this country.

We furthermore wish to express our definite opposition to a Jewish state in any part of Palestine.

[fernand]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door dagallemaal

Daar staat niet in wat ik vroeg te bevestigen:

Ik zou het toch maar eens herlezen, want daar staat het werkelijk in!blz 23. om U te dienen!

[dagallemaal]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door fernand

Ik zou het toch maar eens herlezen, want daar staat het werkelijk in!blz 23. om U te dienen!

Zal eens opzoeken. Wat ik daar dus zou moeten vinden volgens jou is

Hitler had met Churchill afgesproken om alle Europese Joden naar Madagascar te deporteren!

.

Ik hoop dat er dan ook correcte referenties instaan en in welke context het staat of zou "afgesproken" zijn.

[dagallemaal]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door bruut geweld

typische tactiek :

u bent een anti semiet
wij zijn slachtoffers


DIT MAAKT HOEGENAAMD GEEN INDRUK MEER ! dat spelletje hebben de zionisten tientallen jaren kunnen toepassen, maar het is uitgemolken.
en dan spreek ik over de overgrote europese meerderheid die blijkbaar meer en meer anti zionist wordt.
als jij mij en dergelijke mensen in het kamp van rassenhaters/antisemieten wil steken, snij je in je eigen vlees. Ze kunnen het dan wel eens gaan worden...

en de joden zelf verantwoordelijk ? Ja voor het klimaat dat toen heerste ..

Uiteraard niet voor de holocaust ! verwees naar fanatici die daardoor hun kans kregen . uw simpele zwart/wit geest kadert me dan maar bij diezelfde fanatici ..
een arrogantie die typisch zionistisch is ?
nog steeds geen argumenten op mijn posts en anderen , enkel het gekende zaagverhaal : wij zijn slachtoffer en dus mogen wij aLLES ...
da pakt niet meer knulleke

Je hebt er jezelf ingelapt en dan andere voor knul gaan uitmaken is dan wel het laatste dat je zelf zou mogen doen
Ik heb het hier nergens over slachtoffer rol gehad. Toon dat eens aan! Je weet niet meer wat te schrijven en te posten. Alleen maar wat van "gefilpte rabbijnen" en dan nog zonder volgorde.

Voor de duidelijkheid: als rabbijen tegen zionisme zijn is dat voor religieuse redenen en dat mag niets met politiek te zien hebben. Als ze spreken over de goede verstandhouding vanwege de arabieren dan handelden ze zoals vele Joden in de jaren '30: als we niets zeggen enz dan kan ons niets overkomen, want de jodenvervolging onder de Islam was zeker niet te onderschatten.

Als jij die rabbijnen gaat aanhalen als argument voor je "ben eveneens OVERTUIGD anti-zionist " dan heb je een probleem want jij schijnt geen Jood te zijn, noch minder een religieuse Jood en dan zie ik niet waarom jij dat nodig hebt om de staat Israël zijn bestaansrecht te gaan ontnemen.

Meer commentaar op al je geposte zever is Internet verspilling.

[bruut geweld]

uw vorig antwoord staaft alleen uw niet inhoudelijke redenering, vermits je het onderspit delft wordt ik meteen al gepromoveerd van anti smiet naar nazi , of toch een nazistische uitspraak .. HILARISCH

ik heb helemaal niets toegegeven
Je verzint zaken die er niet staan
je speelt de man en niet de bal
je beschuldigt me een antisemiet te zijn
en joden die het niet eens met u zijn , zijn "geflipt"
geen enkel argument is weerlegd , moeilijk als medejoden je eigen leugensachtige zionisme aan de schandpaal nagelen

wie is hier verspilling ?

waarom ik dat nodig heb als niet jood om israel zijn bestaansrecht te ontzeggen ?
MAG IK NOG EEN MENING HEBBEN ? OVER WAT DAN OOK !
OF MOETEN WE EERST UW ZIONISTISCHE TOELATING KRIJGEN ? om nadien enkel het pro-israel standpunt te bekrachtigen ?


Arrogantie en zionisme / blijkbaar een onafscheidelijk duo

[bruut geweld]

de zionist tactiek samengevat :

ik ben een zionist
ik ben deel van een volk dat geleden heeft

ergo : ik mag alles, inclusief een land bijeenstelen
een ander volk verdrukken
VN resoluties aan mijn laars lappen
en zelf wreedheden begaan

en diegenen die dat aankaarten zijn geen anti-zionisten
maar anti semieten en zelfs nazi sympathisanten.

en waarom is het overgrote deel van de wereld nu overwegend anti-zionist ? tiens tiens

[imponderabilia]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door dagallemaal

Go, just go! en neem den Abou en A zus mee. Zij hebben al ervaring

Ik start meteen een liefdadigheidsactie om de vliegtuigtickets te betalen

[dagallemaal]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door imponderabilia

Ik start meteen een liefdadigheidsactie om de vliegtuigtickets te betalen

Perfect en 'k zal aan Flahaut ook een paar vliegtuigjes vragen, alleen moeten we opletten welke piste we volgen (in Zaventem )

[dagallemaal]

Oorspronkelijk geplaatst door bruut geweld

de zionist tactiek samengevat :

ik ben een zionist
ik ben deel van een volk dat geleden heeft

ergo : ik mag alles, inclusief een land bijeenstelen
een ander volk verdrukken
VN resoluties aan mijn laars lappen
en zelf wreedheden begaan

en diegenen die dat aankaarten zijn geen anti-zionisten
maar anti semieten en zelfs nazi sympathisanten.

en waarom is het overgrote deel van de wereld nu overwegend anti-zionist ? tiens tiens

Je zevert jij uitbazuint. Ik schreef dat jij antisemiet bent maar zeker niet om de redenen die jij nu aangeeft maar om je antisemitisme dat uit je reacties "uitstraalt". Jij verstaat er dus echt niets van. Jou antizionisme is gebaseert op antisemitisme en dat is duidelijk en heeft niet te maken met wat de huidige Israelische regering doet of niet doet. Je bevestigd nu wat ik al doorgeprikt had in je postings: je erkent het bestaansrecht van Israël niet en dat is tegen alle VN resoluties in. Jij gaat de VN een lesje geven zeker

En wat vluchtelingen en verdrukkingen betreft zou je beter eerst eens wat lezen over de Joden in de arabische landen en hoe de arabische landen met vluchtelingen omgaan!

In ieder geval heb ik de indruk dat je je van foruml vergist en ik denk dat JIJ wel ziet wat ik daarmee bedoel